Please read ALL of this thread please! All of what you just said have been talked about ...
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BLM moves to downtown Pcola tonight
- Thread starter FrommerStop
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Please read ALL of this thread please! All of what you just said have been talked about ...
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When you say ALL LIVES MATTERS. That the same as ...if you have a wife and she asks (“baby do you love me ?”)and you respond saying (Baby I love everybody) ...do you really think that shit would fly ...hell no it wouldn’t and you know it..when please are screaming BLM they are NOT saying that all lives don’t matter..just black lives matter TOO I don’t understand why ppl don’t get that ... and it sadness me that this country has been built on some much hate and racism that when ppl are protesting that ...ppl think you are protesting America itself!!
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Both snake-eyes and Bholden could be discussing related issues. Big money is for the democrats and also against the right to bear arms. Agent Provocateurs have been to the demonstrations to cause riots. We all know about the piles of bricks being stashed. While people are blaming antifa, some of these people could be in the pay of others. We just do not know exactly. Lots of possible players with money could be paying for this.
Snake-Eyes
Master
I never said the BLM isn't susceptible to the same amount of fringe members as any other organization. I pin the problem squarely on the shoulders of the BLM leadership and PR responsible members.
Ask yourself this: if the organization doesn't agree with the directions of its leadership or PR, then why isn't it changing those "discrepancies"? Answer: because the BLM as an organization is perfectly fine with those actions and representations.
If some thugs were defacing public property wearing USAF uniforms and spray painting "USAF" all over the place and swnding propoganda from social media accounts to with USAF as the names, how long do you think it would take the United States Air Force to respond? From whatever appropriate official level, to address the discrepancy and fraudulent messages?
There is no such response from the BLM, so we must interpret their silence as agreement.
Therefore, I don't carewhat color the skintone of who is participating in the BLM activities, the group is still a racist terrorist organization, until proven otherwise. Because so far, they continue to prove themselves to be just that.
no woryz
Marksman
Ku Klux Klan: Origin, Members & Facts | HISTORY
The Ku Klux Klan (KKK) is an American white supremacist terrorist hate group founded in 1865. It became a vehicle for white southern resistance to the Republican Party’s Reconstruction-era policies aimed at establishing political and economic equality for Black Americans.
www.history.com
If that's rhetorical, then my bad... but in case your really asking...The KKK is a different left leaning terrorist organization and bringing it up only muddies the waters even more. This post is about BLM who in many instances are spreading hate instead of peace. Now looks like another leftist terrorist group Antifa have infiltrated BLM and is changing their message.
Most of us aren't uncomfortable discussing this but were aware that its pointless to offer any dissenting opinion or your instantly labeled a racist. Racism seems to be confused an awfully a lot with discrimination lately too. Below are 2 widely accepted definitions of each. You have to decide whats in your heart regarding these. I am not a racist nor am I a victim of racism. I have been told that I cannot have a job strictly on the basis of the color of my skin. How should I feel about that? That's a great example of discrimination and it happens every day in our society to every race/religion/sex etc. ...
What seems to anger many is that its become acceptable for some to openly discriminate against others. Oddly enough, one can almost swap the term discrimination for either of 2 vastly different terms like profiling or diversity and it becomes more acceptable.
Racism is the belief that groups of humans possess different behavioral traits corresponding to physical appearance and can be divided based on the superiority of one race over another.
Discrimination is the act of making distinctions between human beings based on the groups, classes, or other categories to which they are perceived to belong. People may discriminate on the basis of age, caste, criminal record, height, weight, physical appearance, disability, family status, gender identity, gender expression, generation, genetic characteristics, marital status, nationality,Profession, color, race and ethnicity, religion, sex and sex characteristics, sexual orientation, political ideology, social class, personality, species, as well as other categories.
Hey fellas this discussion is getting really good my responses may be a bit delayed because I am driving home from work but trust me I’m gonna get right back in the ring with you guys once I get home LOL
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I can agree with that and you have a valid point sir. But bottom line we are at a boiling point in this country and now is the time to put the differences aside and try to see other prospectives if we don’t that racial divide will continue to grow!!
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statistics show cops shooting black people have been steadily declining, but the advance of cell phones with cameras and social media have magnified the problem up so everyone thinks it is a epidemic problem ….
Sorry guys... but I’m going to get in my feelings for a minute... speaking from the heart so to speak...you i look at the news and I look at social media...and I really breaks my heart to see the amount of hate rooted in this world that we’ve living in ... it makes me sad that ...these conversations that we were just having on this thread that we have to have them...it hurts me to know that that no matter how pure I’m intentions maybe I will be judge based on my outward appearance. It saddens me that I too will pass judgment on someone else based on there outward appearance...I speak on these matters because I have been with my for damn near 20 years and she is white...We have three boys 16/14/2 and we have experienced racism from both sides of the table both black and white... so trust me when I say I look at the world thru a totally different set of lenses than most you..I have to teach my boys that even tho they are bi-racial they are black to the outside world and I know it’s not fair but that’s just the way it is ... and i shouldn’t have too.. my wife’s family has all but cut her off ... because she married to me! Her own father told her to get an abortion with our first son..I have gotten in a physical fight with my own family members because they disrespected my white wife ... I have been called a Nigger to my face more times then I can count...I have had ppl tell me to be good to my wife because I made her life a lot harder that it should be because she married me... she’s been called a nigger lover more times then I’d like to admit.. and honestly I am ashamed... that we decided to bring another child into this fucked up world.. and that’s just scratching the surface of some of the shit we’ve been thru ... and WHY I LOOK AT THIS COUNTRY THE WAY I DO .. this is the AMERICA I live in!!
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I can certainly understand the pain. People are not always decent and life is often unfair. Hopefully your wife was never stopped and accused of being a prostitute. Years ago I have heard of the cops doing such things. Now days mixed couples are more common and that would be the ultimate solution to the race problem if through time people do what is natural and we become what the spanish call morenos or tan. Some claim that if slavery had lasted another 100 years there would not be any black people, but just a lot of heavily tanned southerners.
Duckyou
I don’t give a Weiner shit!
Grover will appoint some more protestors to the police oversight committee and we will all be welcomed by a warm feeling!
(that warm feeling is the pee coming from upstream)
As far as I understand, the big difference between BLM and something like the Air Force is one requires a signed contract, an oath, a rigid rank structure, and a set of guidelines and standards one must adhere too.
I see it as like, the pro 2nd amendment movement. I mean when someone willingly carries a firearm into a private business that they have direct knowledge does not want firearms present, which there’s an extremely strong argument for trespassing with a firearm(which is a felony), I don’t see the pro 2A commander charging that member with under the 2A code of civilian justice, with punishment up to revocation of membership.
Because it’s not a organization. Even though there’s protests and demonstrations. Even though there’s lobby groups. Even though we’ve won some court and legislative battles.
That doesn’t mean the bundy camp seizing a federal building with arms is indicative to the whole movement.
I find the overuse of the term “protestor” to describe rioters and looters to be grotesque. Everyone does it, either in an attempt to de-legitimize the peaceful protestors, or legitimize radical criminal behavior. It’s no different to me than labeling a psa home build an assault rifle. I understand many protests have turned violent, but it doesn’t change the fact a protestor carries a sign, a rioter a brick and a looter someone’s TV.
I see it as like, the pro 2nd amendment movement. I mean when someone willingly carries a firearm into a private business that they have direct knowledge does not want firearms present, which there’s an extremely strong argument for trespassing with a firearm(which is a felony), I don’t see the pro 2A commander charging that member with under the 2A code of civilian justice, with punishment up to revocation of membership.
Because it’s not a organization. Even though there’s protests and demonstrations. Even though there’s lobby groups. Even though we’ve won some court and legislative battles.
That doesn’t mean the bundy camp seizing a federal building with arms is indicative to the whole movement.
I find the overuse of the term “protestor” to describe rioters and looters to be grotesque. Everyone does it, either in an attempt to de-legitimize the peaceful protestors, or legitimize radical criminal behavior. It’s no different to me than labeling a psa home build an assault rifle. I understand many protests have turned violent, but it doesn’t change the fact a protestor carries a sign, a rioter a brick and a looter someone’s TV.
Duckyou
I don’t give a Weiner shit!
I too am in an inter racial marriage - although only 7 years in and with a 3 and 1 year old.
I am frustrated with people who do not recognize the great changes this country has made.
This country is the greatest in the world - and that is why everyone tries to get here.
outcomes are not guaranteed - but if you work hard and do not do stupid things then you can succeed.
More people need to be taught the true secret of life:
LIFE SUCKS!
You have to work to make the best of it.
I have yet to win the Lotto, but I do have a wonderful wife, two great kids, and we make enough to live a comfortable life.
We moved here three years ago and lived in a tiny home until February when we were able to move into a better home in a great school district.
Do we still have problems? Yes (you should meet my crazy ass family)
But we work hrs to make our life better.
The beauty of this country - anyone can do it!
I agree with you and I have the same values as you ...and I agree that if you work hard for something you can get whatever you want but I promise you that when you have more experiences with dealing with life and defending something that no man should have defend your marriage your optimism with more then likely start to waver like mine did...me and my wife lives very comfortably..and for the most part we are happy with our life ..if we stay within our own circle...(sad but true) and it’s my job as father to keep the outside worlds bullshit away from my kids as long as I can .. but at there age now I have to teach them how to navigate thru life as black men ..how life isn’t fair how you have to move and present yourself in a different manner then there white friends and that they have to worry about things that there white friends don’t have to worry about ...
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if you teach your children young the right way, they will not depart from it.
if Godly values are taught, then they will not have to worry about living as a black man, for discerning people will not notice the color of the man, but the character of a man shows brighter
if Godly values are taught, then they will not have to worry about living as a black man, for discerning people will not notice the color of the man, but the character of a man shows brighter
With all due respect... I strongly disagree with part of that statement.. although that is very true the part if you teach your children young the right why they won’t depart from the godly values they where taught.. but as a black man.. I have a BS in Computer Networking and Information Technology.. very well spoken, grew up in the church never been in jail... never been on the wrong side of the law other than a few speeding tickets.. never done drugs... but my demeanor and my outward appearance may say otherwise. I stand at 6’3 285lbs I’m a fairly big man... for example I live in a predominantly white section of town.. i’m riding my bike along with other people(white ppl) why am I stopped and harassed ..asking me where am I headed asking me where is my ID (like why would I need my drivers license on a bike) ... his reasons for stopping me was because I was going in the opposite direction of traffic ...keep in mind I am not the only one on a bike....and I am not the only one going in the opposite direction of traffic so please tell me why was I stopped??
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I was speaking of a more personal experience, like those you work or interact with.. yes, a casual passerby may make judgements based just on color, but those are not of a discerning nature...
we all make judgements on others, many of them a day, it is up to the individual as to how it effects you, or others
Snake-Eyes
Master
Fair warning: long response. I too had a long day. Here's my brain dump.
You seem like a man with the proper outlook as a husband and father. I can't imagine another similarly decent person, regardless of skintone, who would treat you poorly simply due to your skintone. There are other "good" people out there, too. We are brown/white/yellow/sunburnt/whatever. We are not the problem-set of humans causing the stupid stuff.
The root problem is perception of action.
If we can all agree that pure hatred-motivated criminal LEO's are wrong, and they are a very small percentage of the overall group, then the remaining issues are with one or both sides of a LEO/Citizen interaction.
An officer is usually acting based upon real information coupled with their past experiences. I seriously doubt that every single LEO unit is flooded with white supremacists or Black Panthers. They are our neighbors trying to serve their community in a pressure-cooker job that threatens their life Daily. They are human, and they can make mistakes.
So how to understand where the LEO is coming from versus the innocent suspect in a weird traffic stop like you described above?
I'll simply state that neither side ever has the full story of what's going on. Therefore, assumptions are made, and they are often wrong.
My example from college is very similar to yours. Late night, about 2am, final exams week. Studying for a difficult test, so all-nighter. Decide to ride my bike (pedals, not engine) from on-campus dorm to off-campus 24/7 supermarket to relax and get a snack. Notice a squadcar doing the slow drive by on-campus. Weird. Get to the grocery store, notice another squad car seems to follow me. Huh. Go inside, buy my candy bar and drink, come back out, see two squad cars waiting in the parking lot. Alrighty then. I decide to call their bluff, and ride my bike around the corner towards campus, then once out of sight, flip my bike around to face the way I just came from, and sit there with one foot on the curb, ass on bike seat, other foot on a pedal, partially standing but still straddling the bike, one hand on handle bar, other hand holding the candy bar. I got one bite when the two squad cars come slow-rolling around the corner in formation, and are now pointed right at me. Based on the abrupt brakes, they weren't expecting me there, and they stop moving. I'm in their headlights, eating my candy bar, and the flashing red/blue lights come on.
You'd think I just robbed a bank. They were polite, but on-edge. Asked a lot of questions that didn't make sense, but I remained polite, too. One guy had his hand on his pistol grips the entire time. After a few minutes, they realized I wasn't who they were looking for.
Turns out there was a mugging with a knife not 15-minutes before I decided to go for my ride. I matched the description close enough for them to stop me. Then, my behavior didn't exactly help.
Luckily, I was able to prove a few things, and that was that.
Point is: you could've fit the description for someone else. Not a judgment on you; not a racial slur or generalization. Just simple physics and facts. Since you weren't the suspect, they don't really "have to" explain the situation to you. So, you go about your day wondering "WTF?", and they maybe think nothing of it?
If enough crime is occurring locally, and LEO policies allow stops like that for someone fitting a description/whatever, then that scenario of perceived harassment gets continually replicated.
That's just one possibility, but you can see how the LEO side is mostly just doing their job, and the innocent Citizen is left with a "WTF?" perception of harassment.
Next time, the innocent suspect might be more resistant, and therefore the LEO aren't so polite.
Next time the LEO are more curt and direct, and the innocent is even more cautious/resistant/irritated.
You can see how it only gets worse.
If the citizens could afford to give LEOs the benefit of the doubt, and LEOs could have the luxury of time/personnel to take the extra time to clear up these misunderstandings whenever possible, maybe some of this could be reversed.
This is just interactions between an upstanding Citizen and a good cop.
Change either one of those to a thug/criminal, and all bets are off.
As for the "BLM movement", my perspective is that the message is lost in the delivery. Any legitimacy of their cause is overshadowed and erased by the criminal actions they generate and endorse. They would have more widespread support if they didn't act like thugs breaking stuff, and if their message wasn't only about one skintone.
I firmly believe in the right to protest and use Civil methods to effect positive change.
I also firmly believe in zero-tolerance for domestic terrorism and groups that target innocent bystanders.
Despite many indications to the contrary from the media machine, I still believe that the majority of US Citizens have the right idea. However, these anarchist displays of violence will only cause more division. The terrorists should be dealt with immediately so the remaining adults can continue meaningful peaceful dialogue without further violence.
Many years ago when I had a learners permit and was driving the car of a friend of the family that was black and another kid that was white. The stop was certainly because of Mr. Adams' race in the car. LEOs excuse was I made a bad left turn on what was an empty highway. The other two were carefully critiquing my driving. The turn was proper.
This was also stupid and was going totally on racial appearance. We were in an old woody jeep that was used for hunting and fishing by the owner and we were dressed roughly with Mr Adams in the middle that was the reason for the stop. When I presented my drivers permit and then Mr. Adams presented his drivers license that also had his pistol permits visible, the reason came out.
Cop blurts out where did you pick him up and shouted at Mr. Adams I do not want see you pistol permits, but your drivers license. (Cop still had not caught on)
Mr. Adams said my driver license is there also and I stated it was his car. After a little bit more time, ding ding that cop finally understood. Here was a black man with two pistol permits in Indiana signed by his sheriff in about 1960. He became politer and sent us on our way. He mumbled something about wanting check the serial numbers of the .22 target pistols in the back and then went on his way.
Mr. Adams was not upset and joking. Saying that as the cop went away he was likely exclaiming two white boys and a nig___ and a car load of guns.
Times in someways were different them
Mr adams when he was 13, his father gave him a .32 and a .38 and gave him lecture about keeping them out sight and not acting stupid with them. At 13 in a christian family your were a man.
When I got a P17 Enfield for christmas he opened a box in his woody jeep and detached about hundred rounds of linked 30-06 from the rest of the belt. He also knew the game warden land one day we stopped by his house and Mr Adams gave him some boxes of M1 carbine ammo.
He had a fine collection of revolvers and did a lot of reloading. The culture of Indiana in those days was not so different from Kentucky and southern Illinois in those days.
This was also stupid and was going totally on racial appearance. We were in an old woody jeep that was used for hunting and fishing by the owner and we were dressed roughly with Mr Adams in the middle that was the reason for the stop. When I presented my drivers permit and then Mr. Adams presented his drivers license that also had his pistol permits visible, the reason came out.
Cop blurts out where did you pick him up and shouted at Mr. Adams I do not want see you pistol permits, but your drivers license. (Cop still had not caught on)
Mr. Adams said my driver license is there also and I stated it was his car. After a little bit more time, ding ding that cop finally understood. Here was a black man with two pistol permits in Indiana signed by his sheriff in about 1960. He became politer and sent us on our way. He mumbled something about wanting check the serial numbers of the .22 target pistols in the back and then went on his way.
Mr. Adams was not upset and joking. Saying that as the cop went away he was likely exclaiming two white boys and a nig___ and a car load of guns.
Times in someways were different them
Mr adams when he was 13, his father gave him a .32 and a .38 and gave him lecture about keeping them out sight and not acting stupid with them. At 13 in a christian family your were a man.
When I got a P17 Enfield for christmas he opened a box in his woody jeep and detached about hundred rounds of linked 30-06 from the rest of the belt. He also knew the game warden land one day we stopped by his house and Mr Adams gave him some boxes of M1 carbine ammo.
He had a fine collection of revolvers and did a lot of reloading. The culture of Indiana in those days was not so different from Kentucky and southern Illinois in those days.
Very well said sir ...I totally agree with you that everyones perceptions are misconstrued about ppl that don’t act or looks like them because of past experiences and interactions... and that is where the problem lies .. how do we as ppl STOP passing judgement on others based on past experiences??.. But we all have been taught as small kids when you go near the stove your parents always say “Hot don’t touch that it’ll burn you” and then of course we touch it and see, shit that really was hot!! So now we as kids got this etched in our brain that all ovens will burn you!. Until we are old enough to figure out why the oven burnt you In the first place..deal with ppl is no different...and this is why we as ppl need to start changing the narrative..we’ve got it ..
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