This Just Keeps Happening

[M60Gunner]

One of America’s most popular handguns is allegedly firing on its own, leaving dozens of cops injured: suit

According to the suits against SIG Sauer, some 150 people claim to have suffered injuries, or frightening near misses when their department-issued P320 went off on its own.

nypost.com

 

[DAS HUGH!]

One of America’s most popular handguns is allegedly firing on its own, leaving dozens of cops injured: suit

According to the suits against SIG Sauer, some 150 people claim to have suffered injuries, or frightening near misses when their department-issued P320 went off on its own.

nypost.com

I wonder if that's the woman who's suing because she had it un holstered in her purse?
As I read I found it kinda funny that the ads in the article was showing a trigger finger for sale. Maybe the AI is telling those who read who the real culprit is? ;-)

 

[Snake-Eyes]

I wonder if that's the woman who's suing because she had it un holstered in her purse?
As I read I found it kinda funny that the ads in the article was showing a trigger finger for sale. Maybe the AI is telling those who read who the real culprit is? ;-)

Dude, those ads are targeted at You for your website searches and visitations.

Just... wow.

 

[DAS HUGH!]

Dude, those ads are targeted at You for your website searches and visitations.

Just... wow.

I don't even know what it is. But no. I don't surf weird finger sites, or baby clothes.
EDIT: btw, Google targets ads based on your travels via GPS vs stores you pass that want your business, stuff you buy for your kids and grandkids, your age, demographic, all sorts of stuff. Not just web searches. It's why when people get random ads and swear it was based off of spying on thier phones microphones, it's not. It just saw you drive by a boat store 10x, or so on. Not much can be learned by the random stuff they throw at ya other than the internet is a weird place.

 

[DAS HUGH!]

Dude, those ads are targeted at You for your website searches and visitations.

Just... wow.

So, why would a weird Chinese finger gizmo pop up on a ad inside an article about pistols and if whether or not their finger pulled a trigger?... gee I wonder?
But no let's leap to a perverted accusation! That makes sense! Besides, I didn't even know what it was. How do you know what it is btw? Looks like a novelty trigger finger to me. But hey... whatever

 

[Snake-Eyes]

So, why would a weird Chinese finger gizmo pop up on a ad inside an article about pistols and if whether or not their finger pulled a trigger?... gee I wonder?
But no let's leap to a perverted accusation! That makes sense! Besides, I didn't even know what it was. How do you know what it is btw? Looks like a novelty trigger finger to me. But hey... whatever

Dude. I’m not sure what it is, but it looks like something from an adult toy store. Who cares.

The AI robots are just messing with you.

If I took it personally every time a YouTube video had an advertisement for something weird, I’d be a train-wreck.

Trigger-finger novelty sounds plausible to me.

 

[DustyDog]

Who knows? From the article:

"The cases center on the P320 not having an external manual safety, known as a tab trigger."

First of all, I hate "tab triggers", and I certainly wouldn't call them an "external manual safety".

"Attorneys bringing the cases say it is a crucial design flaw [the absence of a "tab trigger"] that makes the gun liable to fire spontaneously, with disastrous consequences."

Well, NO, a "tab trigger" does nothing to prevent "firing spontaneously", they don't even prevent "unintentional trigger activation", since anything that "unintentionally" contacts the trigger defeats the tab. But the lawyer thinks otherwise:

"That device, known as a tab trigger, needs to be depressed “intentionally” to make sure the gun can fire."

NOPE. Press a "tab trigger" UNINTENTIONALLY, and it can STILL fire.

The absence of a "tab trigger" cannot be the cause of these incidents. Whether they are being dropped, the triggers unintentionally pulled (could even be by clothing caught while holstering)... something else must be going on. If "tab triggers" were the solution, there wouldn't have been any incidents with Glocks, would there?

 

[DAS HUGH!]

Dude. I’m not sure what it is, but it looks like something from an adult toy store. Who cares.

The AI robots are just messing with you.

If I took it personally every time a YouTube video had an advertisement for something weird, I’d be a train-wreck.

Trigger-finger novelty sounds plausible to me.

Well... "DUDE"!! "who cared?"... YOU CARED!
You then went and accused a member here of being a pervert based on what could be a dam coat hook for all I know. I have no clue how to use it the way you implied.
Then, after I calmly explain why you're wrong, instead of saying "oops my bad," you act as I'm I'm the one overreacting.
Wow.
Anywsys... back to reality

 

[DAS HUGH!]

Who knows? From the article:

"The cases center on the P320 not having an external manual safety, known as a tab trigger."

First of all, I hate "tab triggers", and I certainly wouldn't call them an "external manual safety".

"Attorneys bringing the cases say it is a crucial design flaw [the absence of a "tab trigger"] that makes the gun liable to fire spontaneously, with disastrous consequences."

Well, NO, a "tab trigger" does nothing to prevent "firing spontaneously", they don't even prevent "unintentional trigger activation", since anything that "unintentionally" contacts the trigger defeats the tab. But the lawyer thinks otherwise:

"That device, known as a tab trigger, needs to be depressed “intentionally” to make sure the gun can fire."

NOPE. Press a "tab trigger" UNINTENTIONALLY, and it can STILL fire.

The absence of a "tab trigger" cannot be the cause of these incidents. Whether they are being dropped, the triggers unintentionally pulled (could even be by clothing caught while holstering)... something else must be going on. If "tab triggers" were the solution, there wouldn't have been any incidents with Glocks, would there?

I recently saw another accident shooting with a 320. Cop was doing a felony chase so his heart was surely pumping. He opens his door and grabs his gun out of his holster as he exits, then boom!
He claims he didn't touch the trigger and it shot all by itself, just like so many others. I took this screenshot where you can see his finger on the trigger...

 

[Snake-Eyes]

Well... "DUDE"!! "who cared?"... YOU CARED!
You then went and accused a member here of being a pervert based on what could be a dam coat hook for all I know. I have no clue how to use it the way you implied.
Then, after I calmly explain why you're wrong, instead of saying "oops my bad," you act as I'm I'm the one overreacting.
Wow.
Anywsys... back to reality

:|

I was actually just trying to remind you that the “ads” are usually targeted. It doesn’t mean it’s directly from your Amazon shopping list (although that’s usually the sarcastic joke that people assume). As you mentioned, it could be one of many reasons that the AI overlords choose to inundate us with advertising for weird shtuff.

I simply didn’t agree that it had to do with the content of some part of the article as much as it had something to do with your account/computer that was accessing the article.

Relax, man, lady, dude, sir, ma’am, whatever. I didn’t accuse you of anything.

Jokes. Humor. Thick skin. Stuff we need around here.

Nothing ill-intentioned from me.


Back on topic:
It’s a pistol, not an armed and self-aware robot capable of autonomic decisions/actions. It doesn’t just spontaneously fire on its own. More detailed info here:

https://www.sigtalk.com/threads/sig-p320-accidental-discharge-problem.432160/#post-6117588

 

[DustyDog]

I recently saw another accident shooting with a 320. Cop was doing a felony chase so his heart was surely pumping. He opens his door and grabs his gun out of his holster as he exits, then boom!
He claims he didn't touch the trigger and it shot all by itself, just like so many others. I took this screenshot where you can see his finger on the trigger...

Hell, not only that, but it looks like his middle finger on the trigger!

They talk about "firing spontaneously", but how many times has one of these fired while sitting unattended on a nightstand, for example? (and yes, there appears to have been a "drop safety" issue early on, but that doesn't constitute "spontaneous firing", either) If you're participating in a pistol match, snag your shirt in the holster while holstering, then the gun goes off when you raise your hands to stop the timer (as another guy on YouTube did who appeared to be blaming the pistol)... that is not likely "firing spontaneously".

Note that I don't claim to know what is actually going on, and will be the first to admit that American manufacturing is increasingly staffed by people who have no business operating precision machinery, so... (don't get me started about the flash hider that blew off of my new Mini after about 80 rounds... not due to lack of torque, but due to an apparent attempt at threading an oversize hole, probably because they were running the tap for 5.56 hiders into hiders drilled for .30 cal.! : )

 

[M60Gunner]

My thoughts were perhaps the pretensioned striker is the issue? In the video the shot goes off while in the holster untouched as the officer walks to her patrol vehicle. Over 150 cases now up from 119 last time I checked. Personally I don’t understand the need for the lighter quicker triggers Leo has seemed to demand over the last decade but I’m an old cop who appreciated the heavier trigger on my old M9. IRL my adrenaline made it feel like nothing at all to pull through. Ymmv

 

[DustyDog]

My thoughts were perhaps the pretensioned striker is the issue? In the video the shot goes off while in the holster untouched as the officer walks to her patrol vehicle. Over 150 cases now up from 119 last time I checked. Personally I don’t understand the need for the lighter quicker triggers Leo has seemed to demand over the last decade but I’m an old cop who appreciated the heavier trigger on my old M9. IRL my adrenaline made it feel like nothing at all to pull through. Ymmv

Even that vid makes me wonder. It looks like she was carrying an armload with both arms. Was anything caught in the holster? What was her right hand doing? We can't tell from that video. And again, the gun wasn't just "sitting there" when it went off. Still give me the willies, though : )

P.S., How about this: What if it's possible to short-rack the slide just enough for the striker to slightly catch the sear, but not fully engage? That could make them hyper-sensitive to any movement. I try to make sure that I always "bottom out" to the rear when racking... don't half-ass it : )

EDIT: NOPE. Assuming they have a striker-block (I haven't looked at the parts breakdown), that^^^ wouldn't explain it, because the trigger would still need to be pulled for it to fire in that circumstance. Unless the striker-block is sticking in the "up" position, etc., etc. Back to the drawing board : )

 

[DAS HUGH!]

:|

I was actually just trying to remind you that the “ads” are usually targeted. It doesn’t mean it’s directly from your Amazon shopping list (although that’s usually the sarcastic joke that people assume). As you mentioned, it could be one of many reasons that the AI overlords choose to inundate us with advertising for weird shtuff.

I simply didn’t agree that it had to do with the content of some part of the article as much as it had something to do with your account/computer that was accessing the article.

Relax, man, lady, dude, sir, ma’am, whatever. I didn’t accuse you of anything.

Jokes. Humor. Thick skin. Stuff we need around here.

Nothing ill-intentioned from me.


Back on topic:
It’s a pistol, not an armed and self-aware robot capable of autonomic decisions/actions. It doesn’t just spontaneously fire on its own. More detailed info here:

https://www.sigtalk.com/threads/sig-p320-accidental-discharge-problem.432160/#post-6117588

Man, I literally was the one making a light hearted joke and you took it to a weird extreme. Just stop talking about it, especially if you insist on the snarky passive aggressive smart-ass tone like some woman, the way they'll dance around being wrong while taking subtle little jabs as they do. Say what ya mean and get it out at least. Or say your wrong and apologize like a dam man should. Or kindly STFU.
And sir will do just fine thanks

 

[DAS HUGH!]

Even that vid makes me wonder. It looks like she was carrying an armload with both arms. Was anything caught in the holster? What was her right hand doing? We can't tell from that video. And again, the gun wasn't just "sitting there" when it went off. Still give me the willies, though : )

P.S., How about this: What if it's possible to short-rack the slide just enough for the striker to slightly catch the sear, but not fully engage? That could make them hyper-sensitive to any movement. I try to make sure that I always "bottom out" to the rear when racking... don't half-ass it : )

Yeah I seriously wonder if that's the case of the woman with the gun in purse. She had a similar case to another guy who's suing I read about who had his gun in a duffle bag, no holster at all. Sad thing is they know they'll likely get settled and paid. I wish it goes to a judgment so we can see what really happened

 

[Rebel_Rider1969]

More gun control- owned company?? Bricks still rule.

Hard to have an ND unless you drop it on your foot

 

[Snake-Eyes]

Man, I literally was the one making a light hearted joke and you took it to a weird extreme. Just stop talking about it, especially if you insist on the snarky passive aggressive smart-ass tone like some woman, the way they'll dance around being wrong while taking subtle little jabs as they do. Say what ya mean and get it out at least. Or say your wrong and apologize like a dam man should. Or kindly STFU.
And sir will do just fine thanks

1) “Just stop talking about it”? Impossible now. You’re the one who has rubber-finger ads and apparently a phobia talking about what they might be.

2) You think my tone is snarky? Sweet. I’ll amp it up for you, ma’am.

3) ”Say what ya mean”, couldn't agree more. Your skin is too thin when it comes to discussing the remote possibility of adult toy ads on your computer. You seem to care what we think, AND you seem to assume we think it’s something “perverted”. I’ll repeat my previous point: “who cares.” I’ll repeat your answer: “You do.”

4) I don't owe an apology, even “like a dam man“. Is that someone who works on large concrete structures that hold back large quantities of water? Just curious. (more snark for you; FREE BONUS!)

5) I’m not aware of how to “kindly” STFU. Usually, when someone tells someone else to “STFU”, it’s not meant “kindly”, so why should they expect the recipient to be kind? They shouldn’t. That’s unrealistic and shows misplaced arrogance. Since you couldn’t possibly be unrealistic with misplaced arrogance, I’ll just infer that you don’t actually expect me to “kindly STFU”. Hence my response from numbers 1 through 5.

6) “thanks”. You are welcome.


Now, as for the Sig P320 “epidemic” of negligent discharges, I’m more interested if someone can actually prove that the gun fired without any outside inputs. Like somehow there is a hair-trigger setup that can be actuated with the slightest touch to some part of the gun OTHER than the trigger. Has anyone found that kind of proof or event?

 

[DustyDog]

Yeah I seriously wonder if that's the case of the woman with the gun in purse. She had a similar case to another guy who's suing I read about who had his gun in a duffle bag, no holster at all. Sad thing is they know they'll likely get settled and paid. I wish it goes to a judgment so we can see what really happened

Yep, and note that I edited my post that you quoted. The "striker-block" issue came to mind while I was in the shower : )

 

[DAS HUGH!]

1) “Just stop talking about it”? Impossible now. You’re the one who has rubber-finger ads and apparently a phobia talking about what they might be.

2) You think my tone is snarky? Sweet. I’ll amp it up for you, ma’am.

3) ”Say what ya mean”, couldn't agree more. Your skin is too thin when it comes to discussing the remote possibility of adult toy ads on your computer. You seem to care what we think, AND you seem to assume we think it’s something “perverted”. I’ll repeat my previous point: “who cares.” I’ll repeat your answer: “You do.”

4) I don't owe an apology, even “like a dam man“. Is that someone who works on large concrete structures that hold back large quantities of water? Just curious. (more snark for you; FREE BONUS!)

5) I’m not aware of how to “kindly” STFU. Usually, when someone tells someone else to “STFU”, it’s not meant “kindly”, so why should they expect the recipient to be kind? They shouldn’t. That’s unrealistic and shows misplaced arrogance. Since you couldn’t possibly be unrealistic with misplaced arrogance, I’ll just infer that you don’t actually expect me to “kindly STFU”. Hence my response from numbers 1 through 5.

6) “thanks”. You are welcome.


Now, as for the Sig P320 “epidemic” of negligent discharges, I’m more interested if someone can actually prove that the gun fired without any outside inputs. Like somehow there is a hair-trigger setup that can be actuated with the slightest touch to some part of the gun OTHER than the trigger. Has anyone found that kind of proof or event?

Like I said. A man would simply say my bad and move along. I didn't imply you was a man. You assumed that part. No one claimed you're behaving like a man should. So I instead owe you an apology i admit. I wasn't clear and my manners precluded me from being crystal clear. So I'm sorry sir. I'm sorry that I wasn't clear and you mistook what I said and thought I was comparing you to a man. I'm sorry that I just wasn't plain myself and just say what I meant also.
I meant to say you're being a little bitch. And I do apologize. I hope this time you get the message.
I hope that now that I instead apologize to you makes this better somehow.

If so inclined we can acid test who's right or wrong. We can have you make the same comments to random men in public, then count how many teeth you have left at the end of the day. This method is far more simple and yields the best results. It's, crystal clear! ;-)

 

[IronBeard]

More gun control- owned company?? Bricks still rule.
View attachment 225355 Hard to have an ND unless you drop it on your foot

That looks like one of those less-lethal bricks.