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IRAN bombs US held base in Iraq


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wildrider666

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Some years ago we did accidentally kill about 300 or so when we downed an iranian passenger play. It was mistaken identity.
Not quite the same. The Ship was directly involved in hostilities and chasing gunboats that fired on a U.S helo into Iranian Waters. Jet known to have launch from a Joint mil/civ airfield that based Iranian F-15s. Ship warned the unknown aircraft for several minutes (civ and mil freqs) before defensive action was taken and the jet shot down. 9/11 Demonstrated what commercial jets can do, so does Germanwings Flt 9525 with what a single pilot can do. The Ukrainian Jet just took of from an Iranian airport and was shot down within 2-3 minutes.

Interestin fact: The Ukrainian Flt and the Irainian Air Flt 655 (that we shot down) were to fly to the identical Route: Tahran-Bander Abbas-Dubai. There's been at least four other civilian jets shot down.

I surmise that the Jets Corporate HQ wanted their 3 year old jet out of Iran as they, like most of the World thought Trump was going to release an immediate shit storm. Bad timing.
 

FrommerStop

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The point of jets being shot down is that during conditions of perceived imminent attack when decisions have to be quickly made even the USA can make a terrible mistake.
Whether the USA action was not so bad and more excusable I plain do not know. i do not have that information and even if I had the data I would not be able to analyze it correctly on my own.
After a screw up everyone when possible tries to put the best light on it that they can. The Iranians were initially going to deny it all. But they got a bunch of canadians and also an Ukrainian aircraft with pictures from everybody and his brother of the ground to air missiles hitting the plane.

This proves Gen. Sherman was correct when he said: War is Hell

According to the picture the US Naval Captain got a medal for it. I do not know if that happened.

 
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Snake-Eyes

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Frommer, of all of the possible graphics and pictures available on the interwebs, you use one put together by Iranian state media. Check the watermark at the bottom. Gee, I wonder why it's so biased?

Blood-splattered with doves flying away, children perished, U.S. awards "medal of courage". What a bunch of bullshit.

There is NO comparison between the US military and the Iranian state terrorists.
If we make an error, it's still during the performance of lawful combat operations and usually in defense of others.
Those ass-clowns in Iran make errors all the time, and it's during ILLEGAL terrorist actions while trying to murder others.
 

Ric-san

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The primary missle was Fetah-313 like mobile Scud we have seen before. HE payload has probably been reduced from 1100 pounds due to new reduced nose and attemps towards a better guidance system displacing payload. Reports range from 13 to 22 fired: two didn't detonate on impact, four hit in Iran territory and at least four landed outside of bases perimeters. Mobile launcher movement/positioning was detected well in advance of the two stages of launching.

Iran propaganda machine has stated 80 killed & 200 wounded but no photos because all the bodies were immediately flown out on helicopters.
All coalition Countries individually reported ZERO casualties as reported by Al Jez. and Iranians will read that too.

Additionally, the success of Irans threats toward other "Hosting" Countries is questionable. If these Countries bow down to Iran dictate now and pust U.S. forces to leave, what will they do when Iran comes for more when U.S. support is no longer there?

Since damage from missile attacks was pretty insignificant and the President has shown restraint due to that fact, will Iran poke again? Mixed signals from Iran state "revenge" has been completed and other warnings this was the first step of many planned attacks.

Let's not forget that North Korea is paying close attention to the actions and responses. They may well try to add to their saber rattling play book.

Trump said he wants NATO to take more responsibility in the region. However, when Iran started the heavy threats before the missle attacks: NATO Forces in the area stopped all military training of host nation military and LE and withdrew from those Countries. I wouldn't expect anything from NATO.
Thanks for the good scoop. I knew the missiles were a derivative of older Scud technology. It seems they also used a different missile in the mix, found this out by reading more on this subject The “Qiam” a liquid-fuel missile.

https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/meet-qiam-missile-iran-used-blast-us-airbase-112911
 

FrommerStop

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Frommer, of all of the possible graphics and pictures available on the interwebs, you use one put together by Iranian state media. Check the watermark at the bottom. Gee, I wonder why it's so biased?

Blood-splattered with doves flying away, children perished, U.S. awards "medal of courage". What a bunch of bullshit.

There is NO comparison between the US military and the Iranian state terrorists.
If we make an error, it's still during the performance of lawful combat operations and usually in defense of others.
Those ass-clowns in Iran make errors all the time, and it's during ILLEGAL terrorist actions while trying to murder others.
I do not think well of the Iranian 'ass-clowns' and do not think not so much better of those in Washington. But those in DC are our 'ass-clowns'. While Sherman did say war was hell. The real hell is for those that lose. Regardless of the price and the many reasons we should not be there i do want us not to lose. Not because we have god etc on side, but that I live here. I never want a war to be fought again on US soil with the civil war and the Indian wars being the last ones fought here.
As I have gotten older I really do not trust anyone, especially politicians and that is why I absolutely back the bill of rights and the rest of the constitution.
Thanks for the analyses of photo. Did the commander of that naval ship get an award for shooting down the aircraft? Is the caption inaccurate?
 

SAWMAN

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NATO will not pay. NATO will not help. Why in hell are we still a member ??
Come on Don . . . get us the hell out of that do nothing money pit. ---- SAWMAN
 

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NATO will not pay. NATO will not help. Why in hell are we still a member ??
Come on Don . . . get us the hell out of that do nothing money pit. ---- SAWMAN
I agree 500%.

All of this relative to Iran goes back to the overthrow of Mosaddegh in '53. Below is the wiki account of it. This I believe is the original start of the Iranian hatred against the USA. It was over oil that I believe we needed then.

The 1953 Iranian coup d'état, known in Iran as the 28 Mordad coup d'état (Persian: کودتای ۲۸ مرداد‎), was the overthrow of the democratically elected Prime Minister Mohammad Mosaddegh in favour of strengthening the monarchical rule of Mohammad Reza Pahlavi on 19 August 1953,[5] orchestrated by the United States (under the name TPAJAX Project[6] or "Operation Ajax") and the United Kingdom (under the name "Operation Boot").[7][8][9][10] It was the first covert action of the United States to overthrow a foreign government during peacetime.[11]
Either we leave
 

SAWMAN

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AND - - -> the Parliment of IRAQ voted to ask us to leave their country.
Whip-whap-whoop . . . PERFECT TIME TO GO. They dont want us. The mothers and fathers with sons and daughters in that SHIT HOLE COUNTY don't want to see any more of their children slaughtered (like just several days ago) time to get the fuck out. ( Take our equipment when we go)
Leave them to Iran. Let them merge if they want to. It will just be a bigger target in the future.
Seems like it is ONLY the politicians that want the occupation. GREAT !! . . . let them go on over and "occupy". Take the big wigs of the arms manufacturers and any of their shareholders,load 'em up and send 'em over.
When we are all out of Iraq . . . send the cargo planes back to Syria and get us da fuck outta there also.
Come on Trump . . . DO WHAT YOU PROMISED !!!!! ---- SAWMAN
 

Snake-Eyes

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... Did the commander of that naval ship get an award for shooting down the aircraft? Is the caption inaccurate?
I'm not gonna fact-check the Iranian Propoganda machine. I'm going to trust my decades of experience and my present-day instincts and my English-speaking skills: YES, the caption is inaccurate.

- There is no "medal of courage"
- the airplane didn't have an oil tanker's worth of blood splattered on it like a giant water-balloon.
- the airplane didn't have birds flying out of it
- I don't give a shit about how many people and kids were on-board that airliner. For many reasons that don't matter here.

Facts can be spun with propoganda and verbiage to imply a lie. Graphics tell their own story. Put them together and you have a purposefully misleading product. Standard ops for the pieces-of-garbage in charge of policy and decisions in Iran.

You can continue to waste your time believing the Iranian reports. Go listen to to CNN and MSNBC. Those idiots actually used the Iranian state media as a CREDIBLE SOURCE on the night of the missile attacks.

So far, in this Country, you are still free to have your own opinion and train of thought. You continue to compare Iranian actions with ours. You continue to imply what you will.

That's not worth my time.
 

FrommerStop

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It was a 'Legion of Merit'
WASHINGTON (AP) _ The Navy has granted commendation medals to the commander and the anti-air warfare officer who were serving aboard the USS Vincennes in 1988 when the Aegis cruiser shot down an Iranian airliner over the Persian Gulf, a spokesman said on Monday.

A Navy spokesman, Lt. Cmdr. Craig Quigley, said a Legion of Merit was given to Capt. Will C. Rogers III for ″exceptionally meritorious conduct in the performance of outstanding service″ during his command of the ship from April 1987 to May 1989.

The ship’s weapons and combat systems officer, Lt. Cmdr. Scott E. Lustig, was granted two Navy Commendation Medals, Quigley said.

One award was for his ″meritorious service″ during his May 1984 to December 1988 tour aboard the cruiser. The second was in recognition of his role during an engagement with seven Iranian gunboats in the Persian Gulf on July 3, 1988.

″His ability to maintain his poise and confidence under fire contributed directly to the calm and professional atmosphere throughout the combat information center,″ the citation said of Lustig.

Although the skirmish with the Iranian vessels occurred shortly before the Aegis shot the airliner down - killing 290 people aboard - the tragedy isn’t mentioned in the texts of the citations, which were made available by the Navy.

The accident was blamed on a series of human errors that resulted in Rogers’ decision to shoot down the airliner.

A Navy investigation found that the tactical information coordinator had reported that the airliner was descending, when it actually was ascending, a mistake that led Rogers to believe his ship was under attack.
 

wildrider666

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It was a 'Legion of Merit'
One Award for a specific event was for action against "gunboats". Nothing favorable about shooting down the Jet nor any mention of it. The other two Awards presented above: covered large periods of Time/Duty and are known informally as "end of tour" awards. Award Citations contain within the narrative: the justification(s) for Award to the individual(s)/group/command. If the Citations don't list an event it is not considered revelant. If the U.S./DOD/MIL were going to "praise" those persons regarding the Iranian jet: that "justification" would be listed AND IT'S NOT!
So all statements that Awards/Medals were given for "shooting down the jet" is a pure propaganda LIE!
 

FrommerStop

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One Award for a specific event was for action against "gunboats". Nothing favorable about shooting down the Jet nor any mention of it. The other two Awards presented above: covered large periods of Time/Duty and are known informally as "end of tour" awards. Award Citations contain within the narrative: the justification(s) for Award to the individual(s)/group/command. If the Citations don't list an event it is not considered revelant. If the U.S./DOD/MIL were going to "praise" those persons regarding the Iranian jet: that "justification" would be listed AND IT'S NOT!
So all statements that Awards/Medals were given for "shooting down the jet" is a pure propaganda LIE!
I think my last post lists many of the knowable facts. With what you say you know about how these awards done may be enough of an explanation. Does not seem on those facts that there was any censure for shooting down that plane.
A pipe bomb was used on the Rogers' car.
Bomb Blows Up Van Driven by Wife of Vincennes Captain; She Escapes
By LEONARD BERNSTEIN and RICHARD A. SERRANO
March 11, 1989
12 AM
Times Staff Writers
SAN DIEGO —

The wife of Capt. Will Rogers III, skipper of the San Diego-based Vincennes, escaped unharmed Friday morning moments before a pipe bomb exploded under her van, igniting a fire that gutted her vehicle at a busy La Jolla intersection.
The case at least publicly was never solved and later the authorities said it was personal and not terrorism.
Wiki
Five months later, the Associated Press reported that the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) had shifted focus away from terrorism towards the possibility of someone with a personal vendetta against Captain Rogers.[15] As of 2003, the bombing of Rogers' van remains an unsolved case, despite a major investigation involving at some time up to 300 police and FBI agents.[16] On February 17, 1993, the case was featured on the TV show Unsolved Mysteries, but no additional information was uncovered.
Naval career following Vincennes
Rogers' next assignment was as commanding officer of the United States Navy Tactical Training Group at Naval Base Point Loma, a group responsible for training officers in handling combat situations.[14] He retired from the United States Navy in August 1991.[2] In 1992, Rogers and his wife Sharon co-wrote a book, Storm Center: A Personal Account of Tragedy & Terrorism which describes the events surrounding the downing of Iran Air 655 and the minivan bombing from their personal perspectives.[
 

wildrider666

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There was no Gov/Mil "Censure" towards Capt or Crew. I don't know if the entire Admirals Report has been released. U.S. sent Regrets and paid some compensation. The Capt continued in Commanding Officer positions. I don't know about the wife's car bombing but as you referenced "it's unrelated". I'm moving on.
 

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Please correct me if I am wrong.
The aircraft that the Vincennes shot down was traveling way off course. It was closing on the Vincennes. Many attempts were made to communicate with the aircraft . . in several different languages.
When the aircraft got within the ships safe zone,it was shot down.
People . . . ever hear of the 21ft rule ?? How close to you would you allow a man,walking toward you with a knife get,before you would shoot him ?? ---- SAWMAN
 

Snake-Eyes

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Iranians attacked our troops and killed an American, so we rid the world of their terrorist general.
Iran shot dozens of missiles into Iraq and AGAIN tried to kill Americans.
On the same night Iran shot down an airliner.

Somehow, the pot-stirring managed to shift the thread from Iran dropping bombs on Iraq to some kind of BS "Warren Commission" about Flight 655 where the U.S. is now on trial...

Perfect misdirection and blame shifting. Straight outta the democrat playbook. Well done.

Can you all start a different thread for this crap?
 

FLT

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Hmm , A deep cover liberal is someone who supposedly pretends to be ultra-conservative with the intended purpose of discrediting conservative political parties or conservatives in general. They act in a way contrary to their own beliefs and often sacrifice their credibility to defend the public against world-renowned nut jobs .
:confused::confused:
 
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SAWMAN

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Why was the aircraft exiting Iranian airspace shot down ??
Just a possibility - - -> The aircraft was outbound Iranian airspace. Couldn't the radar operator tell this ?? This was a large aircraft verses a missile. Couldn't the radar discriminate between the two ?? The aircraft was climbing out at 250-300kts or so. An inbound missile is flying faster than that. Couldn't the radar operator tell the speed of the target ??
Soooooooo . . . What could be other reasons why the aircraft was shot down ?? Was there someone or some thing aboard the plane that the Iranians did not want to leave the country ??
Maybe plans,blueprints,other documents that would prove embarrassing to the government ?? Mabe someone attempting to leave/defect ?? Possibly BOTH ??
Seems that there was an awful fast attempt to "clean up". Bulldozers scrapeing up the wreckage into piles. Front end loaders scooping it up and loading it into dump trucks. This seems to be no way to preserve the scene but a great way to hide or eliminate truth telling information.
Hummmmmmm. . . ??? --- SAWMAN
ADDED: Those of you that think that this is a possibility . . . I can tell you another about a "3 meter dredge".
 
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FrommerStop

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Sawman there can be all sorts of explanations for shooting down a passenger plane. First look at the competence of those doing the shooting down and also their mental state. I know that when Iranians were trained at NAS and other military bases during the time of the Shah their reputation for competence was very low. They were also highly excited and likely trigger happy.
But as you say there could be other hidden reasons that the world public will never learn. Likely US or Israeli intelligence would know, but have no reason to share. I recall two instances of non-military planes being apparently brought down. The two I can think was Dag Hammarskjöld, UN secretary general and President Samora Machel, pesident of Mozambique. Marchel's plane crashed in South Africa on landing approach to Maputo, Mozambique. There is still debate on the Mozambican crash of whether it was an accident or did the following occur.
While there was widespread suspicion that the apartheid-regime of South Africa was involved in the crash, no conclusive evidence has emerged.
 

FrommerStop

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Recommended reading from Congressman Gaetz from his recent email

Iran’s attack on Iraq shows how precise missiles have become
It scored a series of bullseyes

Science and technology
Jan 16th 2020 edition https://www.economist.com/science-a...n-iraq-shows-how-precise-missiles-have-become


Jan 16th 2020

SATELLITE PHOTOGRAPHS of Ain al-Asad, an air base in western Iraq currently used by American forces, showed the aftermath of an Iranian ballistic-missile strike on January 8th. They were pictures of precision. Iran had struck at the heart of the sprawling base, in an area packed with planes, helicopters and buildings. The precision, however, was paradoxical. The missiles scored six direct hits, but against evacuated aircraft hangars. This, presumably, was enough retaliation for honour’s sake after an American air-to-surface missile had killed Qassem Suleimani, a prominent Iranian general, five days earlier, without being sufficient to provoke counter-retaliation. “The most important takeaway from Iran’s strike is just how precise their short-range ballistic missiles were,” says Vipin Narang of the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. “The accuracy revolution is real and no longer a monopoly of the United States. This has huge implications for modern conflict.”
 
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