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Feeding issues with Federal HST

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  • bpreston

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    Has anyone ever experienced FTF (Failure to feed) with federal HST? After choosing it for my carry gun, Glock 43 most of the time, I’ve had several occasions where the tip of the bullet gets stuck on the bottom edge of the feed ramp. I assumed mag issue right away and bought a new mag. This did not solve the problem. I like the HST, but I’ll ditch it if I’m gonna have reliability issues.


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    Jpyritz

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    I don’t have a Glock but my cz p07 carry gun shoots them perfectly. that said, all gun are different and I wouldn’t carry anything that I haven’t ran at least 300-400 round without any failures. There is a a lot of good carry rounds out there. Try a few box’s of each to see what is reliable for you. I personally carry Speer Gold dot 124 +p. I’m in the camp of not buying in to the hype of “Gucci” Ammo. I think folks worry to much about “ the best” carry round. Shot placement is king, but I also won’t ever carry FMJ rounds as carry ammo.
     
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    BluesBrother

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    Surprised, Glocks usually feed everything. Check the feed ramp for irregularities, polish. Full disclosure, I'm a Glock fan and Federal HST.
     

    SAWMAN

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    Polish the feed ramp and underside of the bbl hood until they look like chrome.
    Use OEM Glock mags.
    Problem solved. --- SAWMAN
     

    bpreston

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    Mags are OEM GLOCK, and it’s not just getting slightly hung up on the feed ramp. The projectile is impacting the bottom edge of the barrels feed ramp. I can try to take a picture later of what is happening.

    Also it should be noted that the issue is always with the 2nd round in a magazine.

    It’s like the mag spring isn’t pushing up with enough force to clear the bottom of the barrel and make it into the feed lip.


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    bpreston

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    What modifications have you made to the gun or the mags? What’s the round count?


    Deadly Threat Defense LLC
    Firearms Training near Pensacola, FL

    No mods other than sights and hogue grip. Mag is completely OEM.

    Approx 500 ish rounds

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    wildrider666

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    In spite of the eat everything Glock reputation, sometimes FTF occure in a few ammo/models combinations and this is individual gun dependent in most cases. Could be large HP opening or small defect snag points on the projectile. OR Ejector pressure Canting.

    On the gun mechanics, (before you work the feed ramp) you need to check if the cartridge is pushed up hard against the underside of the ejector. This pressuer causes the cartridge to "cant" toward the ejector side. When the cartridge is pushed out of the mag : the nose of the projectile is not centered on the feed ramp resulting in a FTF. In SAFE AREA: Clear pistol, close slide. Insert FULL mag. Pull Slide back and Lock. Insp. For canted top cartridge. Cycle through and inspect each cartridge in top "ready to feed" position. The fix for this issue is minor filing of the bottom inboard corner of the ejector.

    Found this specifically on G43 and HST, has Pics
    https://www.glocktalk.com/threads/g43-failure-to-feed.1693424/
     
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    bpreston

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    I'll have to take pictures to show exactly what is happening, but as best as i can describe, when the slide catches the rim of the casing to feed it, the bullet nosedives into the bottom of the barrel. Its like the spring is underpowered.

    I actually have a ghost extra-power spring laying around, but i wanted to run an all stock mag for reliability.
     

    bpreston

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    Traded for it about a year ago. I’ll give Glock a call tomorrow to see what was changed. I’ll be running something other than the 43 until I can get the issues ironed out.


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    SAWMAN

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    The "Glock Guru" once told me . . . . "If your Glock (or mags ) does not feed or function,the first thing you do is return it to its stock (from the factory) configuration". If it does not work properly,send it back to the factory.
    If it does work properly,then slowly add the parts back as you do a function check. --- SAWMAN
     

    bpreston

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    159d13fca4e7a0e21cb38caf1f42232d.jpg
    fb983107db3a56f2108c53c64c3bae9d.jpg


    This is what’s happening. Hard to get a good pic, but from the second picture it looks like the round is angled slightly down.


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    bpreston

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    It does. At one point they had extensions on them, but they now have stock base plates. Two of them have ghost 11% extra power springs.


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    wildrider666

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    You need to get rid of the variables while troubleshooting. Only use "stock Glock factory" mag and mag parts. Is the "new" mag a GLOCK OEM?
    As I think you've had mags apart, are the mag springs properly orientated?
    Each cartridge always seated fully to the rear?

    From pic two (when blown up) there are small (<) shaped cuts/wear marks that originate at the case mouth. Also in this pic the stoppage "appears to be" with the projectile ABOVE the feed ramp and the nose not jammed into it.

    G42 single stack & G27 double stack (probably G43) mags have sharper angles to feed due to short barrel related geometry. The top forward edge (Toe) is raised higher and is an intentional contact area. As the cartridge is pushed forward, the curved/angled side of projectile hits the Raised Toe contact area which raises the nose as the increasingly wider portion of the projectile rides over it. This is basically a mag ramp for aligning the cartridge with the barrel feed ramp. You wont find it on larger Glocks. Is the case mouth binding on this "mag Toe Ramp?

    With a loaded mag in hand, SLOWLY push a cartridge forward as if loading. You should observe that somewhere along the side of the projectile: it contacts a deliberate metal reinforced lip (mine has a slight forward cant, metal visible). Hopefully, the tip/hollowpoint/design won't T-bone the mag Toe Ramp and passes above it. At this point, continued forward movement of the cartridge WILL angle up the nose for better alignment onto the Barrel feed ramp before the rim is released from feed lips. Is the hang up point the nose or case mouth binding there? Recall the slide contacts the top of the rim and diagonally the bottom of the case mouth hits the mag Toe Ramp: Perfect Storm. Lol
     

    bpreston

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    You need to get rid of the variables while troubleshooting. Only use "stock Glock factory" mag and mag parts. Is the "new" mag a GLOCK OEM?
    As I think you've had mags apart, are the mag springs properly orientated?
    Each cartridge always seated fully to the rear?

    From pic two (when blown up) there are small (<) shaped cuts/wear marks that originate at the case mouth. Also in this pic the stoppage "appears to be" with the projectile ABOVE the feed ramp and the nose not jammed into it.

    G42 single stack & G27 double stack (probably G43) mags have sharper angles to feed due to short barrel related geometry. The top forward edge (Toe) is raised higher and is an intentional contact area. As the cartridge is pushed forward, the curved/angled side of projectile hits the Raised Toe contact area which raises the nose as the increasingly wider portion of the projectile rides over it. This is basically a mag ramp for aligning the cartridge with the barrel feed ramp. You wont find it on larger Glocks. Is the case mouth binding on this "mag Toe Ramp?

    With a loaded mag in hand, SLOWLY push a cartridge forward as if loading. You should observe that somewhere along the side of the projectile: it contacts a deliberate metal reinforced lip (mine has a slight forward cant, metal visible). Hopefully, the tip/hollowpoint/design won't T-bone the mag Toe Ramp and passes above it. At this point, continued forward movement of the cartridge WILL angle up the nose for better alignment onto the Barrel feed ramp before the rim is released from feed lips. Is the hang up point the nose or case mouth binding there? Recall the slide contacts the top of the rim and diagonally the bottom of the case mouth hits the mag Toe Ramp: Perfect Storm. Lol


    New mag is a Glock OEM mag.

    Those marks on these rounds are definitely from me cycling the gun manually trying to figure out the cause of the malfunction. After cycling them (in a safe area, pointed in a safe direction) like 100 times they got a bit beat up.

    No the projectile is not binding on the "mag toe ramp" but the casing does ride up this part at one point, which I believe is normal. The nose of the round is impacting the feed ramp and not allowing it to ride up and into the chamber. As far as I have observed so far, it has been the second round to feed into the chamber that is having issues.

    I called Glock this morning and was basically told to send the pistol in, but I think I'm going to replace the trigger mechanism housing and recoil spring before sending it in. I'm not particularly fond of the idea of mailing my guns.
     

    bpreston

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    If you don’t want to send it in, I can take a look at it for you. Not that I can make any promises


    Deadly Threat Defense LLC
    Firearms Training near Pensacola, FL


    I'm gonna try the replacement parts, but if it keeps up I'll let you take a look to see if you see anything weird.
     

    wildrider666

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    FWIW: Seems there were some G43 mag/mag release issues. Glock was sending mags marked 01under 33388 (there is also an 01 follower) you would return in pre paid mailer your 33388 (no number below.) The 01 had more also had more taper at the top and probably needed a narrower follower. Blogers report buying extra mags with an 02 suffix, I haven't read what changes that represents.
    From this there is a possibility of outdated mags, and one maybe two design changes that do not support interchangabilty of followers
    You might want to check what you old and new mags are.
    Link here, photos at Post #33
    https://www.glocktalk.com/threads/g43-mags-being-replaced.1590352/page-2

    I'd have Glock remedy the situation one way or another before I would add my $$ in parts that should be used to upgrade a fully functional G43 not bandaid over a failure point while increasing required force to rack slide and use depress slide release. Different strokes .... Lol.

    If you want to trouble shoot further:
    Is round #2 in the stack the ONLY FTF position? Dry cycle through the entire mag load, pull the slide back, dump #2 and continue dry cycling slingshot method until slide lock. Dump/clear as needed. Repeat a few times for continuity. Result?

    When testing: Is it the SAME #2 round FTF when you insert the mag with:
    A. Slide OPEN then Slingshot.
    B. Slide Open then slide release.
    C. Slide in Battery, insert mag than slingshot. This allows "Slide to run over" the top cartridge (as happens during your noted FTF #2. Does it Feed #1 and FTF #2 or did the FTF SHIFT to #1?

    Good luck either way.
     

    bpreston

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    I was able to recreate the problem this afternoon and I decided to test the round that was hanging up, in the same spot in the mag where it was hanging up, in live fire. Everything functioned as it should, but I’ll be running a box or two more through the 43 before carrying it again, or I may look into other Ammo that doesn’t have such a wide hollow point, or I may bite the bullet and ship it to Glock.

    Does anyone know what local FFLs charge for shipping?

    And I appreciate the help from everyone!


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    wildrider666

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    Super! I've been using Hornady Critical Defense there's also Critical Duty. You can read the Specs on the different parameters on their web site.
    Keep us posted.
    WR
     

    bpreston

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    You don’t have to use an FFL to ship back to the manufacture. Go to the UPS distribution on long leaf, declare it, and ship it 2nd day air.


    Deadly Threat Defense LLC
    Firearms Training near Pensacola, FL

    Right, I’m just cheap and don’t want to pay for 2nd day air.


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