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Bear Creek Arsenal 7.62x39 AR for $365

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  • kidsoncoffee

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    https://www.bearcreekarsenal.com/bca-ar-15-complete-rifle-16-4150-parkerized-heavy-barrel-7-62x39-1-10-twist-w-15-mlok

    Link above to bear creek's AR47. Complete rifle with 1 magazine. I have one of their uppers in 7.62x39 and it's a tack driver. Super fun guns. Not a bad deal for $365. There's other great deals on their site if you're looking for uppers in different calibers or other parts. Also ordered a 300BO complete pistol upper with BCG for $185.
     

    OldMan

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    I have a psa 7.62x39 and its as accurate as my 5.56... evidently they have come a long way. I love mine. have 2 and tempted to try the bear creek on also. I must admit I really prefer Nitride barrels to phosphate
    ate coated
     

    SAWMAN

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    Great deal on that gun. Low enough price point to be able to put some money into aftermarket parts like grip,stock,mags,etc,etc.
    Good start to a deer or hog gun. Essentially (almost) a semi auto 30-30Win. --- SAWMAN
     

    FrommerStop

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    I purchased a similar BAC 16 inch upper. It is over gassed and it needed an enhanced firing pin to shooter reliably. I put in a rifle length buffer with three tungsten wts and it functions well. Without the wts with some magazines it would feed two rounds. But now it functions with all of the AR 7.61x39 mags that I have and likely the extractor and other stressed parts with the slower bolt speed will work better. I shoot russian steel type ammo exclusively.
    I plan to get a pistol upper in that chambering once I get some pistol declared lower receivers, that is receivers that have never been used or intended for a rifle. I will also look around for an pistol upper that has a piston unit and also the springs associated with the piston, that way with a pistol it would be fully funcion without the stock being extended for use in very close quarters.
    I have a lot of ak ammo and so there is a good reason for having such AR uppers.
    here is another reason for selection of AR pistols instead of rifles for new aquisitions.
    The new 2020 ballot amendment only regulates rifles and not pistols, so even if that amendment passes it appears that the pistols would not be regulated. This law would include likely more than half of the .22 rim fire rifles out there since many guns have tube magazines that hold more than 10
    This subsection shall be construed in conformity with the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution as interpreted by the United States Supreme Court. 1) Definitions -a) Assault Weapons - For purposes of this subsection, any semiautomatic rifle or shotgun capable of holding more than ten (10) rounds of ammunition at once, either in a fixed or detachable magazine, or any other ammunition-feeding device. This subsection does not apply to handguns. b) Semiautomatic - For purposes of this subsection, any weapon which fires a single projectile or a number of ball shots through a rifled or smooth bore for each single function of the trigger without further manual action required.
    https://dos.elections.myflorida.com/initiatives/fulltext/pdf/70490-3.pdf
    Bill status not on the ballot yet
    Screenshot_2019-05-28 Initiative Information.png
     

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    War-Buff

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    https://www.bearcreekarsenal.com/bca-ar-15-complete-rifle-16-4150-parkerized-heavy-barrel-7-62x39-1-10-twist-w-15-mlok

    Link above to bear creek's AR47. Complete rifle with 1 magazine. I have one of their uppers in 7.62x39 and it's a tack driver. Super fun guns. Not a bad deal for $365. There's other great deals on their site if you're looking for uppers in different calibers or other parts. Also ordered a 300BO complete pistol upper with BCG for $185.

    I've been considering building an AR pistol for some time but I'm just not that terribly hot on the idea so I never did. Anyway, the mention of a .300 Blackout upper for $185 caught my eye. I looked on the BCA site and found this one for $183.90 https://www.bearcreekarsenal.com/bca-ar-15-complete-pistol-upper-assembly-10-5-4150-parkerized-heavy-barrel-300-blackout-pistol-length-gas-system-1-8-twist-w-10-mlok
    The video on the page mentions a discount code 704tactical which made the total, with free shipping, $174.70 . I know little about AR pistols and I'm not certain that's the upper I really want, but a complete upper w/ BCG & charging handle at that price was too hard to pass up so I just ordered one.
     

    Daezee

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    A friend has the BCA 16" 7.62x39 upper...zero problems with it. I recently bought from him a complete BCA 300 Blackout 16" upper...zero problems with it. My 7.5" 5.56 BCA upper has given failures to fully chamber. I found that with the short bbl and corresponding gas port nearer the chamber, some unburnt/partially burnt powder was getting into the action and onto the top round in the magazine and ultimately gumming up the chamber. WW748 and AA2200 powders gave no such problems, but WC844 and WC846 did give the problem. Solution: I clean the upper more often and no longer use WC844 or WC846 powder in it.

    I do note that some BCA bbls are not chrome lined or nitride treated, (but they sometimes use the harder 4150 steel, so that's good) so the bbls could wear sooner than nitrided or chrome lined if that is a factor for you. I am measuring greater wear in my 7.5" BCA 5.56 bbl than with nitrided or chrome lined bbls shot with same ammo and same rate of slow fire.
     

    FrommerStop

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    A friend has the BCA 16" 7.62x39 upper...zero problems with it. I recently bought from him a complete BCA 300 Blackout 16" upper...zero problems with it. My 7.5" 5.56 BCA upper has given failures to fully chamber. I found that with the short bbl and corresponding gas port nearer the chamber, some unburnt/partially burnt powder was getting into the action and onto the top round in the magazine and ultimately gumming up the chamber. WW748 and AA2200 powders gave no such problems, but WC844 and WC846 did give the problem. Solution: I clean the upper more often and no longer use WC844 or WC846 powder in it.

    I do note that some BCA bbls are not chrome lined or nitride treated, (but they sometimes use the harder 4150 steel, so that's good) so the bbls could wear sooner than nitrided or chrome lined if that is a factor for you. I am measuring greater wear in my 7.5" BCA 5.56 bbl than with nitrided or chrome lined bbls shot with same ammo and same rate of slow fire.
    I have also noted the barrels of many BCA are not coated. The 7.62x39 operates at lower pressures than the 5.56 suggesting that barrel wear will require more rounds to cause wear-erosion.
    I like the coating more for resistance to rusting and not just for barrel wear if one forgets to properly maintain the barrel. There may still be some corrosive 7.62x39 out there. Yugo loadings are said to be mildly corrosive for example and the older chinese ammo was also corrosive.
    This means that 7.62×39mm chambered arms in C.I.P. regulated countries are currently (2015) proof tested at 444.40 MPa (64,455 psi) PE piezo pressure. The SAAMI Maximum Average Pressure (MAP) for this cartridge is 45,000 psi (310.26 MPa) piezo pressure.
     
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    Daezee

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    I keep bore wear and rounds fired as part of my shooting and have various gages to use; most people don't keep such records; it adds to my enjoyment of the hobby. But anyway, here's a couple of examples:

    Bear Creek 5.56 bbl 4150 steel, no bore treatment: throat/rifling has worn away .025" in 827 slow fired rounds. "slow fired" = 5 shots and let bbl cool; 5 shots may be fired somewhat rapidly.

    FN, CHF, "double" chrome lined, 41V50 steel: throat/rifling has worn away 0" in 736 slow fired rounds.

    What the heck, let's throw in another bbl: Model 1 Sales 4140, chrome lined, used in full auto fire (normally fired 1 mag of 20-30 rounds and let cool before next mag): throat/rifling has worn 0" in 1839 rounds.
     

    FrommerStop

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    That is fascinating, so if it loses .025" from .224 the front of the chamber is now 0.249 or better than 6 mm. In any case I can see that one wants wear resistant barrel in 5.56 for sure.
    Pressure. C.I.P. defines the maximum service and proof test pressures of the .223 Remington cartridge equal to the 5.56mm NATO, at 430 MPa (62,366 psi).
    It would appear that such a barrel is no longer very accurate.
     

    Daezee

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    Throat erosion is the wearing away of the rifling, not of the bore, where it starts in front of the chamber. In other words, the rifling now has its full diameter further away from the chamber so the bullet has to go further before fully engaging the rifling and start spinning. Gages are easy and cheap to use, but the most accurate way of measuring bbl wear would be periodic shooting of groups until the group size exceeds YOUR needs, in which case the bbl is worn out for YOUR use. US Military uses (or used to use, I do not know what they use now) throat erosion gages, as that is easy for the armorer to use. US standard for .30 cal and below was rebarrel when the throat gage shows the rifling has worn away 1". They even had standards for how good the bbls had to be before being used overseas since rebarreling out of CONUS or in a war zone might be more difficult (throat could not have more than 1/2" of wear). The manual Rebuild Standards TB ORD 366 is real good for rebuild standards on how things used to be.

    I've worn out 3 30 caliber machine-gun bbls. In each case when the throat erosion gage reached the reject line (or 1"), within 250-500 more rounds the 100yd groups would suddenly go from inches to feet across. A friend has a worn out M16 bbl that exceeds the 1" of throat wear (5.56 ammo key holes when used); he uses it with a .22 rf conversion kit...it works fine for that with minute of can accuracy.

    Again, while the military had bore wear gages for the M16 family, I do not know what they use now. When I was with the Marines in the 1970's they used rounds fired before the M16 had to be sent to higher echelon maintenance for a new bbl per the Marine manual Inspection and Repair of Shoulder Fired Weapons. However, the Battalion I was with (2nd Medical Bn, 2nd FSSG, 2nd MarDiv) did not keep track of rounds fired that I was aware of, and I was the alternate armorer. Certainly no one asked me to keep track of rounds fired when I used the M16 in our rifle team. The battalion actually didn't do much shooting at all until I came and discovered a quarterly ammo allowance which was not being used...so let's start shooting! How about 40,000 ball and tracer rounds shot through 1 M60 bbl...now that bbl was worn out and tagged for blank use only.
     
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    FrommerStop

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    Throat erosion is the wearing away of the rifling, not of the bore, where it starts in front of the chamber. In other words, the rifling now has its full diameter further away from the chamber so the bullet has to go further before fully engaging the rifling and start spinning. Gages are easy and cheap to use, but the most accurate way of measuring bbl wear would be periodic shooting of groups until the group size exceeds YOUR needs, in which case the bbl is worn out for YOUR use. US Military uses (or used to use, I do not know what they use now) throat erosion gages, as that is easy for the armorer to use. US standard for .30 cal and below was rebarrel when the throat gage shows the rifling has worn away 1". They even had standards for how good the bbls had to be before being used overseas since rebarreling out of CONUS or in a war zone might be more difficult (throat could not have more than 1/2" of wear). The manual Rebuild Standards TB ORD 366 is real good for rebuild standards on how things used to be.

    I've worn out 3 30 caliber machine-gun bbls. In each case when the throat erosion gage reached the reject line (or 1"), within 250-500 more rounds the 100yd groups would suddenly go from inches to feet across. A friend has a worn out M16 bbl that exceeds the 1" of throat wear (5.56 ammo key holes when used); he uses it with a .22 rf conversion kit...it works fine for that with minute of can accuracy.

    Again, while the military had bore wear gages for the M16 family, I do not know what they use now. When I was with the Marines in the 1970's they used rounds fired before the M16 had to be sent to higher echelon maintenance for a new bbl per the Marine manual Inspection and Repair of Shoulder Fired Weapons. However, the Battalion I was with (2nd Medical Bn, 2nd FSSG, 2nd MarDiv) did not keep track of rounds fired that I was aware of, and I was the alternate armorer. Certainly no one asked me to keep track of rounds fired when I used the M16 in our rifle team. The battalion actually didn't do much shooting at all until I came and discovered a quarterly ammo allowance which was not being used...so let's start shooting! How about 40,000 ball and tracer rounds shot through 1 M60 bbl...now that bbl was worn out and tagged for blank use only.
    Thanks for the details as what you are measuring. There was a time when for competition shooters, the 30-06 was still the cartridge used and they would often shoot AP ammo when the throat got worn as a way of still obtaining useful accuracy or at least that is how the story went. In a bolt gun I recall hearing people cutting off a little off the beginning of the barrel and then rechambering as a way removing a worn throat and recutting it forward into the barrel. Harder to do with an AR and AR barrels are not that expensive or hard to replace.
    Basically if I understand it the rifling of these worn barrels is good, it is just erosion of the throat.
     

    Daezee

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    Yep, the AP bullet has a longer bearing surface than M2 ball so there was a larger surface to grab the worn rifling. That is my understanding of what is going on.
     
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