APOD Firearms

Polymer 80 for ccw?

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  • Murfpcola

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    If a LEO runs a serial number on a gun from his cruiser what info does he get back? Does it just say "no records found" or does it tell him the make and such of the firearm? If I have mine engraved then it too would say no records found unless I happen to chose a number that has been reported stolen which could happen with as many guns as are out there.
     

    FrommerStop

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    Prior to the GCA of 68, Mfgs were not required to put serial numbers (SN) on firearms. Most Mfgs had already been using internal SNs as an aid to inventory control/tracking. I have owned several Pre GCA firearms that did not have a Mfg SN, its not illegal to own them. BATFE has a proceedure if you want to SN them. Even with Mfgs that were applying SN before the GCA, the occasional firearm woud turn up without a SN because it was pulled as parts for testing (before SN assigned), assembled tested, then placed back on the Line and shipped: this would also be a Pre GCA firearm and legal witout a SN. CA (maybe other gun grabber States) have a law requiring all firearms be serialized including 80% builds which require you request and receive a SN from the State before you build it.

    Destroy a no SN firearm: never. FFLs still log them in acquisition and disposition records/4473s and use NSN Pre GCA in the SN data Block. Can a Licensed Dealer-Gunsmith "take in" a completed firearm made from an unserialized 80% reciever/frame for repair or coatings? From what Iread in ATF Rule 2015-1 YES, as long as the work does not constitute "manufacturing". I don't know what would be listed in the SN data block, NSN completed 80% build?
    I had forgotten about the the pre'68 .22's and shotguns that were without serial numbers. I have never seen a factory produced handgun or a center fire rifle without a factory serial number, but I could not find any precise reference other than someone thinking there was law in '56 that required a serial on these guns. Fact is if I find guns like a smith and wesson or a colt without a serial number that should of had one when it left the factory, I would destroy it on the spot and dispose of it quietly. Yes you can turn it in and maybe they would serial number it for you and get it back to you, but I would not want to chance it. It would be same way if I happened unto a mac 10 or 11 that fired from an open bolt or a machine gun. Guns from which serial numbers were removed are illegal if it was done deliberately.
    Too me it is just not worth the risk of running afoul of the ATF. If there is even a 5% chance I could get in trouble with them I will not take that chance. I understand that they sometimes will relocate a serial number if you want to do some gunsmithing in an area that will not allow the serial number to be read for one reason or another after the work is done.
    Normally if the rules allow them be the ATF personnel are reasonable. The only time I have ever dealt with them was over a question of explosive waste sample shipping from a former Army ammunition plant and lady on the phone in DC was polite and I still remember her name.
     

    War-Buff

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    I have a Remington Nylon 66 .22 rifle made in 11/1959 and it came with no serial number. I've owned it since early 1960.
     

    FLT

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    Many inexpensive guns made before the gun control act of 1968 didn’t have a serial number.
     

    Blindeye

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    I've made a few of these 80% Glock clones.
    The newest versions have an embedded metal plate to take engraving if you choose to put it there.
    As everyone has mentioned, it's not required by Federal law if you make it yourself, for yourself (California requires it be engraved with a serial no. and registered with the state).

    The older ones (no metal plate/all polymer frame) take really nice engraving from a laser used for engraving trophies; the laser cuts nicely into the polymer, unlike the superficial marking it does on metal (I'm speaking here of the typical 60W lasers the trophy shops use).
    The REAL lasers (cutting, engraving, welding) are 1 to 1.5KW; I know because I went to China to see about purchasing one.
    One of those would slice through a frame like it was tissue paper.
     

    Big Shrek

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    If I were to build an 80%, I'd put 00001 on it. the next would get a 00002 :)
    and so on and so forth...

    And yeah, NOW is the time to buy. Political Climate is UGLY.
    The Fix is IN...and lots of truly stupid people vote.
    It's almost to the point where one would want to get a good sized ship
    and have it registered in a gun-friendly country, just in case one needs to GTFO.

    Time & Time again, when a country disarms...another country that hasn't
    ends up kicking their butts and taking over. China could easily walk all over us
    if the Liberals end up disarming us. The ONLY thing keeping them from doing it,
    is the "Gun behind every blade of grass".
    GC1.jpg


    Make no mistake, disarmament is their goal.
    So sayeth their choice for Prez, 2020.
    13339440_287606904913232_5804309749316333303_n.jpg
     

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    Jester896

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    I see where MidwayUSA is running some Zev slides on sale and Brownell's is running some Swensons on sale
     

    bluedog46

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    The grip will be more in line with typical guns than the glock stock grip. I actually sold my glock 17 because of the grip. it was fine when it was the only gun i shot, but as soon as i started shooting 1911 as soon as i switched it was left and a bit low with the glock that did not happen with any other guns i shot ( beretta, m&p9, 1911s, cz). i plan on getting one. The thing that sucks is that the non-80% ones are usually timber wolf and really expensive compared to the 80%
     

    FrommerStop

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    The grip will be more in line with typical guns than the glock stock grip. I actually sold my glock 17 because of the grip. it was fine when it was the only gun i shot, but as soon as i started shooting 1911 as soon as i switched it was left and a bit low with the glock that did not happen with any other guns i shot ( beretta, m&p9, 1911s, cz). i plan on getting one. The thing that sucks is that the non-80% ones are usually timber wolf and really expensive compared to the 80%
    For me your carry and fighting guns should handle the same as much as possible. To have glock like gun and glock OEM with different grip angles is not good. Settle on one or the other. The polymer homemade glock would be something that one sets aside for the day Elizabeth Warren, demoncrap (and ex-native american) politician comes to take my OEM glock away from me.
     

    wildrider666

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    Since there is no Fed serial# requirement for "home builds", I would inscribe it: FUCK GUN CONTROL or another important message. If the firearm ever hits a reporting requirement the message will be repeated.
     

    wildrider666

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    I wonder how the no serial number will play out with Universal Background Check (registration scam) if passed? Gun grabbers will be screaming "Loophole" again!
     

    SAWMAN

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    If the Dem's get serious,I can see the "build your own gun to get around the laws" to very quickly disappear.
    There WILL BE a mass shooting with one of these "self made in yo mama's basement killing mo-shinez".
    THEN . . . whip,whap,whoop . . . fuckin' gone. Expect the Repubs to vote for gone. You can't even get 8 or 9 of them POS's to vote for boarder security.
    SHAMEFUL !! --- SAWMAN
     

    bluedog46

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    I wonder how the no serial number will play out with Universal Background Check (registration scam) if passed? Gun grabbers will be screaming "Loophole" again!

    Yet all these illegal beaners breaking into our nation and breeding like roaches on our tax dollars is not considered a loophole.
     

    FrommerStop

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    I wonder how the no serial number will play out with Universal Background Check (registration scam) if passed? Gun grabbers will be screaming "Loophole" again!
    In home manufacture is not included in the interstate commerce laws currently and hopefully the courts will keep it that way. That is why they can not regulate home manufacture of firearms other than deciding what is an 80% receiver.
    but of course the constitution means little to gun banners and we shall see.
     

    wildrider666

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    Some Fed Laws also apply to "Home Builds". As an example an 80% AR receiver to SBR still requires full NFA compliance, so would a 80% 1911 with a shoulder stock. "For personal use". Builds must conform to allowable standards or the NFA applies. (AOL, barrel length and bore, , rifling, stock configurations). I think Commiforina now requires serialization and registration.

    The Authority/Powers under the Interstate Commerce Act can be applied to anything bought, sold or moved and can includes things that are only within a State (Case Law) For the most part, 80% receivers are simply "parts" for now. All gun Laws are derived from powers to Tax (Constitutional aammendments) or the interstate Commerce Act, both of which have grown by self empowerment of the Federal Gov.
     

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