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Latest from the ATF: No more opinion letters Unless . . .

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  • SC-Texas

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    Latest from the ATF: No more opinion letters Unless . . .

    This is interesting. Just received from the BATFE.


    The BATFE will not render an opinion on the effect of an accessory on a firearm unless that farm is included with the accessory and install them the accessory when it is sent to the batfe. One has to wonder if the fact that the ATF is supposedly about to render some new regulations has something to do with this email that I received today.

    The effect that this ruling has on the industry is profound. It greatly increases the cost of bringing new accessories to Market. The accessory manufacturer who is Seeking a determination from the batfe must install the proposed accessory on the firearm that it will be used on and send that combination to the ATF Tech Branch for a determination. This will have a extreme chilling effect own small manufacturers and large manufacturers ability to innovate and bring new products to Market.

    It will also stop every Tom Dick and Harry from riding random letters to the ATF asking them if something is legal or not which often has resulted in contradictory opinions.

    Discontinuance of Accessory ClassificationsEffective Immediately:

    The Firearms Technology Industry Services Branch (FTISB) classifies firearms as defined by the Gun Control Act (GCA) and National Firearms Act (NFA) based on the configuration and the design features of the firearm as submitted by members of the industry.

    Effective immediately, any requests for a determination on how an accessory affects the classification of a firearm under the GCA or NFA must include a firearm with the accessory already installed. Except in cases of conditional import determinations, FTISB will not issue a determination on an accessory unless it is attached to the submitted firearm.

    If you have previously submitted a sample accessory for classification, FTISB will be returning your sample without classification. FTISB will contact you in the near future with further instructions to facilitate the return of your sample.

    https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/USATF/bulletins/22189c1


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    SC-Texas

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    Wow, I wonder when and if this ends up in court.
    Unfortunately, I do not think you will end up in court. The courts have generally given federal agencies great latitude in interpreting how they will enforce congress's will as evidence by the laws passed by Congress.

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    Fanner50

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    Now, lets see if they go back and revisit accessories such as the Sig Brace and other devices that make a firearm almost a SBR without having to do the paperwork dance. I would not be surprised if they do.
     

    stage20

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    Now, lets see if they go back and revisit accessories such as the Sig Brace and other devices that make a firearm almost a SBR without having to do the paperwork dance. I would not be surprised if they do.
    They've got to have something better to do than this
     

    SC-Texas

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    I wonder if they will prosecute people for sending in illegal firearms?

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    wildrider666

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    I have no idea what inspired this. All accessories not yet Ruled on are being sent back without action. You now have to sent the accessory MOUNTED on a firearm! Do you need to send a firearm/Accy for every gun application for the acessory? I guess if you send a gizmo attached to a firearm (per this doc) and they Rule its a NFA Item: your screwed! That is unless you did the NFA paper work/pay, wait 9 months for Tax Stamp after guessing at what they might classify it as (even if thats not what you intended). Otherwise they got you for violating NFA Mfg and Possession. Not that they won't change an Approval and screw you later as has been done before. More data colection on names, guns, serial numbers and addresses for their non-data base!

    Now if you sent NFA paperwork in (just to be safe before manufacturing your accessory to firearm) they will MAKE A DETERMINATION WITHOUT THE ITEMS you requested Stamps on. Yes folks, they will tell you its NFA or Not all without sending gun/parts/accessories to them. It will take almost a year and hold your money hostage but its their own rules circumventing this new dictate from the ATF.


    Still waiting for the hammer to drop on bump fire devices. Guess they're having problems writing the text on banning pockets, belt loops and fingers: without looking like idiots!
     
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    wildrider666

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    I just blasted some Feedback on this issue to ATF OnLine.

    Industry/mfgs or includes non licensed private citizens.

    Unlawful conflict of direction from ATF. NFA says ask/pay/approve before you build, Bulletin says build/ship and then ATF will decide if you broke any Laws, possibly confiscate your property, arrest, charge and prosecute!
     

    JBryan314

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    Why does the BATFE exist again? Last I checked, all of those things are legal.
     

    stage20

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    What classifies as an accessory? If I put an mbus on my AR or a grip that wasn't there from the factory am I in violation? What about a private sale? Sounds like a can of worms. If you send your firearm in for approval and it's not legal I bet you won't get it back.
     

    Big Shrek

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    Send the firearm and item in unassembled.
    Place Instructions on how to assemble/remove in box.
    That way you aren't sending a possibly NFA-incorrect item...
    and they can return it the same way...unassembled.
    Hence avoiding all those nasty rules.

    Sig Brace...dang near EVERYONE I've ever seen with one at the range is using it in a manner which is ILLEGAL.
    They pull it in close to their shoulder and use it as a stock. If an BATF agent walked in and saw that, they could arrest them on the spot. As could any LEO on scene...just most tend to ignore it unless someone is being a jackwagon.
    Most folks also need to remember that there are now cameras at almost every range...so any LEO watching from the front desk, as so often we all have while looking for an open lane...could nail one of those misusing the brace to the wall.

    Same goes for "The Blade" totally legal when strapped to one's arm.
    Totally Illegal if used as a shoulder stock.

    So save those illegal-style uses for PRIVATE locations...and TETOWAKI when nobody will care how you use it ;)
    Cameras are EVERYWHERE...defensive gun use is now scrutinized to the Extreme, so be cautious!
    All it takes is one Liberal Jackwagon shooting a bit of Video and one could be facing serious Federal Charges!

    Imagine the fun one can have when learning all about an original Colt Carbine Kit...and what happens if you attach it to a NEW 1911...better have a tax stamp before taking it to the range!!
    1911 carbine kit.jpg
     

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    wildrider666

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    Let's propose a sample for ATF opinion: We install a "horizontal fore grip" directly to a pistols "side" quad rail (mfg origional part).

    NFA Def for a AOW includes: "Such term shall not include a pistol or a revolver having a rifled bore, or ..." Pistol being sent has a rifled bore therefore it can not be a AOW per the NFAs definition.

    ATF Ltr of May 4th, 2006 basically says if you want to install a verticle fore grip to a handgun you need to Form 1 it as a AOW first. The ATF has long held ... B.S. (injected to bypass the exception for pistols and revolvers with rifled bores), so Ltr "guidance" only applies to vertical fore grips identified. Mounting is horizontal (90°off vertical). No "Long held" ATF B.S. listed about that. Note: Ltr is 12 years old yet its content has not been added to the Law!

    Would you send the pistol with installed horizontal fore grip in for an opinion? Its only 10 years for "Making" and another 10 years for "Possession" plus $500K total fines if they "Opinion" that Laws have beed violated.

    Seems to me the ATF is not only complicating routine business but deliberately fishing for stupidity, and its not the first time either!
     

    wildrider666

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    In part ... Send the firearm and item in unassembled......

    Arm braces illegal to shoot from the shoulder ....

    Controlling, possession of parts that can be assembled into an unregistered NFA Item is called Constructive Possession and is illegal if parts have no other user applicaton. If you put the "Firearm" and "Parts" in the box you have Costructive Possession. Its like only owning a AR Pistol upper and a AR Rifle lower: there is no alternative application other than assembling a SBR.

    The ATF prohibition on shouldering pistol braces has been rescinded. Users must maintain them in an unmodified, factory issued condition.

    https://blog.princelaw.com/2017/04/...-on-users-shouldering-brace-equipped-pistols/
     

    FrommerStop

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    Many of the larger companies have licenses to make and deal in all sorts of NFA weapons. Some people think the new ruling is being made to stop a multitude of trivial requests requests that they could not keep up with. This ruling will likely be harder on the little guy than it will be the bigger ones.
    I read that ATF ruled it was ok to fire an arm brace from the shoulder.

    https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2...istol-equipped-with-an-sb-tactical-arm-brace/
    Here’s the important bit:

    With respect to stabilizing braces, ATF has concluded that attaching the brace to a handgun as a forearm brace does not “make” a short-barreled rifle because in the configuration as submitted to and approved by FATD, it is not intended to be and cannot comfortably be fired from the shoulder.

    If, however, the shooter/possessor takes affirmative steps to configure the device for use as a shoulder-stock — for example, configuring the brace so as to permanently affix it to the end of a buffer tube, (thereby creating a length that has no other purpose than to facilitate its use as a stock), removing the arm-strap, or otherwise undermining its ability to be used as a brace — and then in fact shoots the firearm from the shoulder using the accessory as a shoulder stock, that person has objectively “redesigned” the firearm for the purposes of the NF
     

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