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Getting into NFA items

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  • Longtooth

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    Ok, so im looking at getting into Class 3 items. Specifically suppressors but I don't really know what Im doing. Does anyone have any advice on either setting up a trust or going the individual route for holding the items?
     

    John B.

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    Don't do it... it's a trap.

    Personally I see no benefit to having a trust unless multiple people are going to be using the same NFA item. Everything I have was form 4 individual.

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    RackinRay

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    With the recent changes on trust and fingerprint requirements; I would say that unless you are going to have others that will need/want custodial use of NFA items, the individual route is easier to get processed. If you have heirs, the Trust might be beneficial for handling the items when you pass. You might use a trust to put the items you acquire into in order to arrange for their transfer or sale after that. There is a good atty in Pensacola that it might benefit you to contact. https://www.gulfcoastgunforum.com/showthread.php?21237&p=182848#post182848

    I am sure that others will chime in soon on the topic. Good luck, and enjoy the NFA toys!
     

    Longtooth

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    I dont have Heirs yet, but Im leaning towards a trust just for the simple fact that I can add someone to it a lot faster then I can get the paperwork filled out and approved for say my dad or my wife.

    Thanks for the heads up on the attorney. I was looking at other threads and I saw the online one that you can do for $130, but Id probably want to talk to someone about setting one up in person.
     

    JoeCorrado

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    Your wait time is longer going the trust route. A bit less than a year going with a trust compared to about 6-7 months individual are the latest I've seen. Just something to keep in mind.
     

    Snake-Eyes

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    Goto Silencershop.com and read up on what they have to offer. They are creative with ways to streamline the purchase process. They have a product called a "Single Shot Trust" that looks attractive.

    Here's a link:

    https://www.silencershop.com/services/single-shot-trust.html

    JoeCorrado mentioned the various wait times. Here's a link to look at:

    http://www.nfatracker.com

    NFA purchases are not for the impatient. Just fill out the paperwork, and forget about it. Some people buy a new item every so often so that once the Form-4's start getting approved, it's like a new toy gets approved "every so often", too! I'm not that rich.

    The individual Form-4 just makes storage a headache if you are married (the spouse can't have access to that safe while you are at work or out of town), or if you are military and might get stationed in a commie state or overseas (would need to be able to leave the items with someone).

    The trusts give you more options for who can have unfettered access, but they can require more paperwork. The silencershop Single Shot Trust gets around some of that.

    Regardless, it is an expensive addiction. NFA items are like the Lays potato chip commercial says, to misquote slightly: "Betcha can't 'buy' just one".

    For your 22LR can, get stainless steel baffles/tube, to make cleaning easier.

    Thread-on suppressors are inherently more accurate and repeatable than quick-disconnect setups. Usually.

    Don't buy one thinking you'll ever re-sell it. Purchase with the thought that it's yours for as long as it lasts. The used suppressor market is almost non-existent.

    Enjoy!
     

    Longtooth

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    Awesome! That’s the kind of information I’m looking for!

    I’m not in a rush, so the wait time doesn’t deter me, but I do want to make sure I have all my ducks in a row. I also want to make sure I adequately plan out my costs.

    Does anyone that has set up a trust have any recommendations or advice on what to do and what to avoid? Also, did you set yours up online or did you contact an attorney?
     

    John B.

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    ....

    The individual Form-4 just makes storage a headache if you are married (the spouse can't have access to that safe while you are at work or out of town)....
    Enjoy!

    That's a bit of a stretch. What about people without a safe


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    John B.

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    Keep in mind, if you go the Trust route, every time you buy an item you will have to get fingerprints and passport photos for every person on the trust.

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    Longtooth

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    Keep in mind, if you go the Trust route, every time you buy an item you will have to get fingerprints and passport photos for every person on the trust.

    Seriously? Is that just for trustees or is that for trustees and beneficiaries?
     

    Snake-Eyes

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    That's a bit of a stretch. What about people without a safe


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    You have to secure the NFA item if it isn't in your "control". Otherwise, you allowed unauthorized people to be in possession of an NFA item.

    Just like when you're at the range with buddies. If they aren't on the Form-4 (at least one of them a member of the trust or LLC on the Form-4), then then you can't leave the NFA items there and leave the area to go take a leak or something. The items are no longer in your control.

    They are now in possession of NFA items illegally.

    If you don't have a safe, any lockable case will work. The people not on the trust/LLC shouldn't have access to the padlock combo or keys.

    If you want to argue about "common sense", that ship sailed the moment the topic centered on the NFA...
     

    John B.

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    You have to secure the NFA item if it isn't in your "control". Otherwise, you allowed unauthorized people to be in possession of an NFA item.

    Just like when you're at the range with buddies. If they aren't on the Form-4 (at least one of them a member of the trust or LLC on the Form-4), then then you can't leave the NFA items there and leave the area to go take a leak or something. The items are no longer in your control.

    They are now in possession of NFA items illegally.

    If you don't have a safe, any lockable case will work. The people not on the trust/LLC shouldn't have access to the padlock combo or keys.

    If you want to argue about "common sense", that ship sailed the moment the topic centered on the NFA...
    I wonder if anyone has ever been convicted for not securing an NFA item in their home? I'm sure if someone was caught with the item outside the house, but actually inside the home? And yeah... common sense is a non-existent term when discussing ATF/NFA logic/procedure.

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    Little Jack

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    A trust is more money/effort up front but it gives you much more flexibilty down the road. You can setup the trust with just yourself so you'll still only need to file with one set of prints and photos. When you add more people to the trust, you'll have to submit their prints/photos for any new purchases, it's not retroactive.

    If you buy a bunch as an individual, you can add them to a trust later but it's going to be another $200 transfer if you wanted to do that.

    If you get a bunch of items as an individual, and you get hit by a bus, the heir/executor of your estate can receive them tax free on a Form 5 but then it's up to them to deal with the subsequent tranfers.

    The single shot trust from silencershop is cheap but instead of tracking one trust, now you've got to update several if you want to allow someone else to use the item. that's if you used the single shot on multiple items.

    There's no "good" time to get into the NFA game. Wait times ebb and flow and ultimately you don't know what the wait time is until the form actually comes back. I'd wager a little that the system/laws aren't going to change much in the next couple of years. HPA/SHUSH seem to be dead and I don't see support for them growing much. If the (R) can keep control of the house and senate after the mid terms, there might some movement...... but I'm not counting on it.
     

    Longtooth

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    Well, its been a few years and I have done both trust and individual - 100% recommend the individual route

    Now to see about moving beyond suppressors. :)
     

    Longtooth

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    I'm going to SBR and SBS before too long.
    I think an SBR will be my next thing to try. Id rather try to get a full auto....... but I don't know many people who have done it or who know the ins and outs of that.
     

    Sixgun

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    Only downside IMO is that if you travel or live near a boarding state you can't take your NFA item until it's form 20 approved. B/c of this I'll be turning a SBR back into a rifle. 10.5 to 13.7 PW vs waiting on the Gov't to tell me I can't take my rifle 10 min down the street? Wasted my money and time over 3.2 inches on that one..
     
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