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What gun stuff did you do today?

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  • Jester896

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    do you think it is a feed lip issue? I ran into a similar issue with my WSM.

    I have used an Accurate mag in a .308 along side AICS without issue. The only real difference I can visibly see is the emblem on the bottom. :) I know my AI mags work fine in MagPul BM as do my MagPul's AI version mags work well in my Badger DBM. In the AICS chassis all you would need to do with a 700 is swap the action and mag and your GTG. I would think any AI compatible mag would work in the proper caliber.

    If I had a .223 mag I would send it to you to try. The 2 links are for AICS compatibles.
     
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    SAWMAN

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    Watching this closely. While I would like to get a MagPul stock for my RARR,if I am destined to buy the $70 mags for it I would take a pass.
    I find it somewhat sad that MagPul will market and sell a "new and better" stock without either selling the appropriate mags to go with it or at least telling you where to go to get them. BUT . . . if MagPul is not in a position of control over the mags that will fit their "new and better" stock,I find that this is a buisness FUBAR in itself.
    My gun shoots great right now. For the price of a MagPul stock and a couple mags wondering if it will make my gun more accurate,easier to carry,etc. Especially if I would have to deal with modifying a mag to hold 5 shots for deer.
    Ruger has designed the RARR "just for me". With the 12.5" LOP,16" bbl,1:7 twist,and the potential of gaining $150 worth of trigger for 10 minutes work,the superb stock bedding system (V blocks,to free float),and cheap initial price,i'm pretty much satisfied.
    Wishing that I would have picked up it's little brother chambered in 5.56X45. --- SAWMAN
     

    TennJeep1618

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    After pricing cabinets yesterday, I modified my design for the new reloading/gun room last night.

    NZkUNLu.png


    I went ahead and ordered the cabinets shown. I'm going to build the big shelf myself, and I haven't decided what to do about the countertop yet. The Southeastern Salvage in Mobile has some nice butcher block countertops on sale, so I may go that route. I can certainly build my own by laminating a couple sheets of 3/4" plywood and putting a piece of hardwood lauan on top, but it will save a lot of time to just buy a countertop.

    vp21YCR.jpg
     

    Daezee

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    Not a feed lip issue exactly, although if the feed lips were higher, it might work. It is the stock (and mag catch combo) that prevent the mag from being held close enough to the rifle action for the bolt to pick up the top round. If you file on the feed lips to hopefully allow the cartridge to stick up further (mags are polymer), you run into the problem of the iips not holding the cartridges before enough material can be removed to let the cartridge ride up higher. Here's my latest summary posted on the Magpul forum: (Jimmy0861 is the Magpul Product Manager)

    Some info from experimenting, searching and replies from others:

    1) May 2, 2017 - Jimmy0861 posted that Ruger mags would not work in the Hunter stock. My fault, I did not remember this conversation or I would have brought it up since it conflicts with item #2 below.

    2) Aug 10, 2018 - Jimmy0861 posted that Ruger AICS .223/5.56 magazines are correct for the Hunter American stock. Based upon that post, since the Ruger mags are readily available, reasonably priced, and I already have 3 of them, I decided to order the stock for my Ruger American Ranch Rifle in 300 Blackout when they become available. Oh, the Ruger AICS mags work perfect in my Ruger Precision 5.56 rifle which is made to use AICS mags.

    3) Aug 29, 2018 my Hunter stock arrives, but all my Ruger mags are too low to feed (bolt doesn't touch the base of the cartridge), but do snap in place. Magpul tech support suggests "tolerance stacking", so I install the stock on another Ruger American with the same failure to feed in the same manner. Stock repeatedly removed and reinstalled with no improvement X3.

    4) Trying the Ruger mags without the Magpul trigger guard installed (holding them as far up into the stock as they will go), they are still too low to feed. Note: Even with the trigger guard installed, it's not like the trigger guard is holding the magazines low in the stock that you can overcome by putting hand pressure on the bottom of them in an attempt to hold them up further in the stock.

    5) Trying the Ruger mags without the action in any stock (holding them against the bottom of the action...a bit awkward to do), they do feed with the bolt face making good contact with the bottom of the cartridge.

    6) Magpul tech support suggested filing on a Ruger mag...that doesn't work. A flaw in filing is that no matter how much material is removed from the top of the mag, the Magpul mag catch will only hold the mag so far into the stock. Another flaw is that removing material from the feed lips to allow the cartridge to stick up further results in the the magazine not holding the cartridges in the mag (feed lips are too far apart). There's only a short distance between the feed lips holding the cartridges and the feed lip distance is too far apart to hold cartridges in the mag.

    7) Magpul tech support (another person) says to buy an AI (Accuracy International made) polymer .223 magazine. I am unable to find any for sale and AI doesn't seem to list them anymore. I get a message that says AI discontinued them a few years ago due to the magazines having a tendency to split along the seam lines. Can find AI STYLE magazines made by other than AI, but hate to spend $ hoping something works. Waiting for a reply from Jimmy0861 as to what specific magazine brand and model will work. I want the stock to work for me as it looks and feels great. Magpul tech support (both people) said do not alter the stock or it can't be returned.

    Edited to add: Examination of the plastic and metal parts without taking the stock assembly apart showed no casting flaws or blobs of metal or plastic that would interfere with the rifle action being properly placed into the stock assembly. All surfaces looked nicely smooth.
     

    Daezee

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    Watching this closely. While I would like to get a MagPul stock for my RARR,if I am destined to buy the $70 mags for it I would take a pass.
    I find it somewhat sad that MagPul will market and sell a "new and better" stock without either selling the appropriate mags to go with it or at least telling you where to go to get them. BUT . . . if MagPul is not in a position of control over the mags that will fit their "new and better" stock,I find that this is a buisness FUBAR in itself.
    My gun shoots great right now. For the price of a MagPul stock and a couple mags wondering if it will make my gun more accurate,easier to carry,etc. Especially if I would have to deal with modifying a mag to hold 5 shots for deer.
    Ruger has designed the RARR "just for me". With the 12.5" LOP,16" bbl,1:7 twist,and the potential of gaining $150 worth of trigger for 10 minutes work,the superb stock bedding system (V blocks,to free float),and cheap initial price,i'm pretty much satisfied.
    Wishing that I would have picked up it's little brother chambered in 5.56X45. --- SAWMAN

    I agree with much of the above. I wanted the stock to do easier shooting from the bench with its flat wide fore end and higher comb and adjustable LOP (most of my plinking is from the bench). As far as hunting, the stock does add weight to the RARR, but it wouldn't matter if hunting from a blind. If I hadn't been told by Magpul that Ruger mags would work, I would not have bought the stock! The 2 tech people I talked with seemed to hint they'd had other calls (saying such as "we are suggesting owners try..."), but didn't say there are major problems with the stock being used for the .223 or Blackout nor did they say this or that fix will work. I stated to each rep I wish Magpul would make the proper .223/Blackout mag to go with their stock and be sold to others that use AICS type mags, but in both cases all I got was silence. I asked that my order be updated to show I've complained twice now.

    The 10rd mags are no problem for Georgia deer hunting, but alas my brother's farm is being sold so this year may be my last Georgia deer hunt.

    The stock looks a bit goofy with the short 16" bbl, but looks real nice when my suppressor is in place making the bbl look longer.
     

    FLT

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    Thanks for giving us a heads up about this problem. I’ve been considering this stock for my rifle and will be waiting for the problem to be resolved before I order a stock.
     

    SAWMAN

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    Yeah Bruce . . . sounds like MagPul could be scrambling to fix a problem that the never knew existed. Wondering what exactly is/was their procedure prior to releasing this stock for sale. Somewhere in this process some damn fool should have spoke up with - ->"Hey,what about mags ??
    SHIT . . . did they start selling 308Win mags before they knew they would actually fit 308Win ammo ??
    I stand by my above post . . 2nd paragraph. --- SAWMAN
     

    Daezee

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    Sawman, you know me. I'm not the sharpest knife, but I'm no dummy either. You've taught me many hunting and tracking things so you know I am teachable. I've spent hours going over all the parts to this puzzle and communicating with some AICS type stock owners, one of which even offered to send me one of the old AI polymer mags for me to try. Either the stock is flawed or Magpul's replies are flawed. Of course I did run into flawed replies from SIG.... There's too much stock in-between the action and the magazine well. There are no actual reviews of the stock in use so far that I can find, only the short videos announcing the stock. I can find no owners of the stock using it on the .223/Blackout rifle, only owners asking if it will work, and the answer is always yes.

    My recommendation for any Ruger American .223/Blackout owner is to NOT buy the Hunter American stock until the bugs are worked out and you know what combination will work.
     

    SAWMAN

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    My above statements and reasoning is not that you did not do your pre-order "homework". It is that MagPul,otherwise known as a great company,that turns out great products,has somehow managed to drop a "ball" that should have been easy to hold on to. Seems to me to be a marketing screw up that could have been/should have been caught prior to the release of this new MagPul product.
    Just wondering at what point do you send the stock back with a letter saying . . . "When your company can send me the stock,WITH mags that will fit and function properly,without breaking out my cutting and sanding tools,I would be interested in buying one". --- SAWMAN
     

    Daezee

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    Magpul did say 60 day return period, but don't alter the stock. I said 60 days might be over before any fix can be applied. Was told they would put notes in my order than I've called twice as it might take awhile to find mags that work.
     

    Jester896

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    It does suck. I use factory BDL on mine ATM. I do have their BM and some mags for a conversion if I want to. I had to modify the feed lips for the WSM. My AI and MagPul AICS style mags run both in my CDI BM and my Badger Ordinance BM flawlessly.

    The .223 mags may be higher from the lock to top to compensate for the difference in boltface size. Accurate does make 5 rd mags, the link I posted was a 10 rd. I might throw the $40 at the MDT from CDI. I think they are also polymer. If it is in stock you should have it the next day since they are in Sarasota.
     
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    TennJeep1618

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    That looks good! I thought about making my own. Might have to look into that looking at the price sticker. Mt BIL is passing through this weekend to help me finish up my siding...maybe he could swing in and pick me one up :)

    FWIW, I think they're on sale for $220ish right now. Still pricey, but probably worth it to me when I think about the time it would take to even cut and laminate plywood myself.
     

    Daezee

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    Returning the Magpul stock for refund. i will allow them to examine it, and if a defect is found will consider them sending me another one (they will have my phone number). Was told that after my phone call yesterday in which I was advised to buy a real AI made polymer .223 mag, Magpul researched their answer and found that mag was discontinued a few years ago (exactly what I was told when I tried to find one for sale). Was also told that the AI polymer .223 mag was the mag used to test and design the Hunter stock to work with the Ruger American in .223/Blackout and that NO OTHER AI type mags were used or tested. I also had the tech guy go to the Magpul forum and showed him where the Magpul Product Manager posted Ruger AI type magazines were correct for the stock. He said he doesn't think the reply applied to the magazines listed. I said it wouldn't be the first time that a posting could be interpreted in different ways. Here's that post BTW:


    Question: Just so I understand this correctly.....this stock should work with my Ruger American Ranch in 5.56? I just need aics style mags in .223? If so, I already have some of the steel and plastic factory Ruger .223 mags for a Ruger scout rifle. They are labeled as aics for Ruger Precision rifle and scout rifle.

    Answer from Magpul: Yes, that is correct.
     
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    Well, in the last couple of days, I have sent out a payment for a Ballistic Advantage 16" Stainless Steel SPR barrel, ordered a MI Combat Rail One Piece Free Float M-LOK handguard, Magpul MOE-SL stock, Aero Precision stripped upper receiver, Aero Precision upper parts kit, VG6 Epsilon compensator, Aero Precision 30mm SPR scope mount, CMT low profile gas block, and a mid-length gas tube. All this for a new AR build. I found the barrel on the ARFCOM EE and snagged it for $100. That set the wheels in motion to order more stuff. Now, I will have only one complete lower assembly and a complete upper receiver laying around doing nothing for a while. Hopefully, I will have this built in two weeks (about the time I get the barrel). Now, I have to get a VORTEX Strike Eagle for it.
     

    Jester896

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    Here's that post BTW:


    Question: Just so I understand this correctly.....this stock should work with my Ruger American Ranch in 5.56? I just need aics style mags in .223? If so, I already have some of the steel and plastic factory Ruger .223 mags for a Ruger scout rifle. They are labeled as aics for Ruger Precision rifle and scout rifle.

    Answer from Magpul: Yes, that is correct.

    SMH...sorry you are not getting the answers you are looking for from the mfg. I agree they should be able to answer this. It can't be that hard for them to pick up a couple of the AICS or even AICS clones to see how they perform.
     

    John B.

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    After 2 years of delays with the release of the magpul hunter for the American platform, I am not shocked.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
     

    Jester896

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    that is how I felt about the release of the L/A 700 version.
    I did get one of the S/A ones.
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    Daezee

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    SMH...sorry you are not getting the answers you are looking for from the mfg. I agree they should be able to answer this. It can't be that hard for them to pick up a couple of the AICS or even AICS clones to see how they perform.

    The person who wrote "Yes, that is correct.", says he did not mean to imply that Ruger AICS magazines were the correct ones for the stock. Their testing was only with an obsolete AI made polymer .223 mag (no longer made for a few years now). I suggested they spend $100-$150 and buy a MDT, a Ruger, and an Accurate AICS pattern .223 mags for testing.

    Actually I think they need 2 versions of the Hunter American stock. The .223 sized one will have a thinner dimension inside top to bottom that allows the rifle action to be closer to the mag well. The .308 case size cartridges already stick up more due to the larger diameter of the case base vs the small diameter of .223 size case diameter. Without the action in the stock, but a loaded mag in place, the difference was obvious to me. But I'm not a designer, so what do I know....
     
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